New DM advice ?

[MooNinja]

Hey guys,


I'm a long time player, and am going to finally take the leap into DMing. I've attempted one shots in the past, a couple of times. They usually don't go as well as I would of liked, mostly due to my inability to convey properly the story I've dreamed up, and then being unable to properly guide the PCs to the next element of the story.

I've decided that I might be ready to give it a full shot with 4e. This weekend I am having the group over to learn 4e. We will do a dungeon delve, and build characters. I know 4e already, so its another reason why I am running =/.

So I've decided on working in a couple mechanics in to my game to help address a common occurrence in games I've been in lately. Also, I'm going to adapt the 4e core modules into the Eberron setting. Eventually I'd love to see WotBS being used, but it isn't out yet.

The mechanics I want to work in are: each gaming session I'll try to shift the roles around to different players so that everyone has access to, and experience with the roles at very least. This can be stopped through some items in the game. They will be rings or Ioun stones that let you lock in your role while you have one. This will help keep absences from derailing gaming nights, and allow people to try a pleathora of different characters.

Also, the role changing will fit in with my theme. I'm shooting for a Horror-lite Eberron setting, where a hamlet on the edges of the Shadow Marches are cut off from the rest of the world, with out their knowledge, and are begining to see the effects of Dal'quor touching the plane there.

Any advice to make this as smooth as possible ? Thanks a ton for any help in advance!!

Moo

 

[KarinsDad]

Any advice to make this as smooth as possible ? Thanks a ton for any help in advance!!

This will be difficult at best and doubly difficult because your players are new to the game and you are new at DMing.

I have two different types of experience with this and neither worked that great.

The first is that missing players in our game do not mean missing PCs. Some other player, typically one of the players who is extremely familiar and knowledgeable on 4E, plays the PC. This works out ok, but I have noticed that as a general rule, if it is not the PC someone is used to running, the PC is sometimes run sub-optimally.

The second is a one shot test of Epic level that I ran. One of my players ran all 5 of the PCs. Even with all of the information printed out from Character Builder, he was pretty swamped and even though we took an excessive amount of time for him to look through different options for each PC's turn, it still was not as good as if a player familiar with the game did it.


My suggestion since you stated that you are a new DM and the group is also learning 4E is that this idea of yours is way too ambitious. It might be ok some time in the future when the group is comfortable with the rules, but you should probably work more on your story, a flowchart of possible events and outcomes, what encounters you want to introduce, etc. than jumping out the gate with having every player playing every role.

Once you get your DMing down, then you can and should experiment with cool ideas like this. JMO.

In the meantime, you could have each player run a different second PC for missing players like we do. This would resolve both your "missing roles" issue and if you spread it around, also your "allow each player to experience each role" issue. It will take longer before each player experiences every role, but it will partially accomplish your goals without overloading you and your players.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

 

[MooNinja]

Thanks a lot for your insight.

I guess I am being a bit overly ambitious.

I'll definitely scale it back a bit, and only have the missing character's slot be replaceable by another character, a different Dal'Quor spirit inhabits that one's body until the player returns or something.

I really need to work on a flow chart. My problem is the steps in between major plot devices most of the time. My grandiose idea font springs eternal, however the functional, and plot driving mechanism font is ever on the fritz lol.

Do y'all believe Keep on the Shadowfell to be a good module to being new players with ?

 

[mmaranda]

KotS is a good first start mod

Keep is a good first start mod. Just remember that the first major battle with an elite opponent can be really rough and has resulted in several TPKs.

For your idea of letting people try different classes and roles, that might be really tough even for an experienced group. Primary stats would need to change if Fred the Fighter became Fred the mage between sessions. Perhaps setup an ingame reason for the PCs to have their spirits transferred between bodies. That way Fred the Fighter can later on play as Fred the Mage and all that really needs to happen is the Fighter and Mage trade character sheets. The additional bonus to this is that the player new to the mage can ask the previous mage player what they think should be done in this situation.

The only caveat here is that if thePCs become attached to thier character they may not want to switch or may not want thier previous character's body hacked into bits when the fighter forgets how a mage should act in combat.

 

[KarinsDad]

Do y'all believe Keep on the Shadowfell to be a good module to being new players with ?

It's an ok module.

You have to be careful as mmaranda mentioned. The first battle can lead to the second battle without a rest and the second battle might be with a very large group of foes with a BBEG in their midst.

I ran it, had the opponents come in waves instead of right away, and it still resulted in a TPK since the PCs chased a foe from encounter #1 into encounter #2. That and one PC purposely used his Encounter powers at the end of the first encounter, even though the PCs had pretty much cleaned it up before he did that. His assumption was that one was supposed to always use every encounter power every encounter.

 

[MadLordOfMilk]

KotS is a solid 4e adventure. Make sure to run the updated one from D&D Test Drive. You can also send a link to the quick start rules there for your players if they want to read through it before playing, depending on their level of curiosity... could also lead to things running more smoothly.

As a DM, I actually started getting into DMing with that module, so I can speak from firsthand experience. Make sure you know the module! Also, don't be afraid of just making things up whenever people ask questions; it is not as detailed RP-wise as adventures of other editions, so you're free to flavor it however you want. The current line of 4e adventures mostly just goes room by room and gives some flavor text and the encounters... I think Wizards reported somewhere that they're aware that people think the modules are a bit light on the RP front. Just make sure to write down any names, etc that you make up/use for reference later.

For general advice, just stay calm. Remember, you're not doing a bad job! Keep your confidence high, and you'll be fine. If you start feeling tired or can't focus, try standing up while you're DMing to keep your energy level up. If you need a minute to read through something you didn't read thoroughly, for example, tell everyone to take a 5 minute break to do whatever (though sometimes everyone just says "I'm good" and it falls flat, but I'm sure people will understand and can find something to occupy 5 minutes).

The 4e DMG is a GREAT book, and I suggest at least reading the early parts before playing if you get a chance to. There are plenty of great suggestions, including how to spend your prepping time.

If combat starts dragging because people aren't paying attention, or people are zoning out then taking forever because everyone else is taking forever on their turns... take a short break and let everyone re-focus their thoughts, or if everyone's just tired don't be afraid to end the session a bit earlier than you'd planned.

Have another player track initiative. This, surprisingly, will take a noticeable load off of your mind as you're trying to keep track of everything. It's particularly nice when you're just beginning to DM and every little bit counts when it comes to brain power.

Also, remember: the goal is to HAVE FUN! Don't let anything get in the way of that.

 

[mindshadow2k]

I have never ran KotS so I cannot give advice on it, but I did see this out there when considering running it at some point and I found this post, having read some of the aventure this conversion is extremely well done and looks very interesting.

H1-H3: Demon Prince of Undeath Conversion - Page 7 - Wizards Community

 

[Greatwyrm]

There are a few things I'd share with you. Most of these are based on my own mistakes, so don't take them as preaching.

First, start small. Smaller combats and one or two encounter scenarios are where you should begin. Then build on those. Lord of the Rings wasn't Peter Jackson's first project. Start small, you'll make it to big.

Second, stick with it. Many GMs will run some bad and mediocre games before they get the hang of it. You'll mess up. It happens. Just do your best to learn from what doesn't work for you.

Finally, get real, honest feedback from your players. Ask them point blank, "How am I doing? What do you think could have been better?" You'll know if you're having fun, but you need honest input from your players to know if they're having fun.