New listings on the WotC 2007 product page!

[Faraer]

Why? If there's a WotC setting that lends itself to big, dramatic, even epic adventures, it's Faerun. Heck, do little adventures even happen there? They sure don't seem to in the modules or novels.

The Realms has suffered 17 years of ill-conceived RSEs inflicted on it for short-term novel sales, but even so the lore (including published adventures and novels) is far more full of the small, local tales which suit it and which it was created for. So with a book that features yet another RSE, whose advertising perpetuates the foolish focus on Elminster and teases flash-bang destruction of the most-loved part of the Realms, the centre of Ed's own campaign, a place of so much history whose people have weathered oppressive governments and terrible strife, we can only hope -- optimistically because this is Eric Boyd -- that it will do it with the care and sensitivity the book-department RSEs have mostly lacked.

I think a three-part hardcover epic adventure series depicting the fall of Shadowdale, the breaking of Elminster's power and the possible rewriting of the laws of magic themselves is exactly the sort of setting most FR fans would like.

Why would we like the destruction of what we love? This series has been met in large part with weary groans on the Candlekeep.com boards. But yes, it's better to treat these threads in adventure than novel form.

 

[Vocenoctum]

I think a three-part hardcover epic adventure series depicting the fall of Shadowdale, the breaking of Elminster's power and the possible rewriting of the laws of magic themselves is exactly the sort of setting most FR fans would like.

I'd amend that with "those of us that got tired of this type of adventure jumped ship long ago".

For the Drow book, I figure it'll have a writeup for more than just Drow, but I still want to see what's in it before buying it. I just can't imagine having 224 pages of drow material.

 

[Arnwyn]

Hijack!

[sblock]

Simply put, not everyone was involved in the discussion previously, and more importantly, not everyone accepts your information as true and correct. In addition, pronouncements from "on high" generally don't carry much weight on the internet, it's usually nice to quantify information rather than simply assuming folks will take your word for it.

My question was rhetorical - I wasn't really expecting an answer (this is the internet after all, and I absolutely agree with your reasons). But in any case, I already referenced the other thread as well as the CBC News report (and should have even mentioned the extra detail they went into in the local papers). And while I do understand that "pronouncements" carry little weight - I don't particularly care. I'm not too worried about educating internet denizens (ripe with ignorance), and if they don't want to take a professional accountant's word on the matter, that's their problem, not mine.

Besides, not all information can be linked (which is something those who spend unhealthy amounts of time on the internet have a hard time dealing with).[/sblock]

The Realms has suffered 17 years of ill-conceived RSEs inflicted on it for short-term novel sales, but even so the lore (including published adventures and novels) is far more full of the small, local tales which suit it and which it was created for. So with a book that features yet another RSE, whose advertising perpetuates the foolish focus on Elminster and teases flash-bang destruction of the most-loved part of the Realms, the centre of Ed's own campaign, a place of so much history whose people have weathered oppressive governments and terrible strife, we can only hope -- optimistically because this is Eric Boyd -- that it will do it with the care and sensitivity the book-department RSEs have mostly lacked.

Preach it, Faraer!

I think a three-part hardcover epic adventure series depicting the fall of Shadowdale, the breaking of Elminster's power and the possible rewriting of the laws of magic themselves is exactly the sort of setting most FR fans would like.

It's exactly what we despise. (Novel readers, OTOH, might eat it up. It has long become clear, though, that FR game fans and FR novel fans are [mostly] mutually exclusive.)

 

[Jason Bulmahn]

You...you bastard. You had to go and ruin my appetite on Thanksgiving.

Ha ha haaaa.. more turkey for me.

Jason Bulmahn
Managing Editor of Dragon
He of the many subtitles
"I just want to reach over and bite it off" -Rob Schwalb

 

[Vocenoctum]

I'm not too worried about educating internet denizens (ripe with ignorance), and if they don't want to take a professional accountant's word on the matter, that's their problem, not mine.

real nice. But even in that other thread, I don't see anything that indicates WotC gets the money, and in this you don't answer how the Canadian stores can discount if they're paying the higher price. I don't throw around my profession on the internet, since it doesn't really matter. Saying you're a professional accountant doesn't mean anything when you don't put information of use in the posts.

It's exactly what we despise. (Novel readers, OTOH, might eat it up. It has long become clear, though, that FR game fans and FR novel fans are [mostly] mutually exclusive.)

I grew tired of it as a novel fan AND an RPG fan myself. I ditched FR for GH years ago, and now embrace Eberron. (And, somewhat fear some of the Eberron novels, they seem willing to involve "grand events" in each one, but luckily they're all localized and don't affect the world at large.)

From an RPG standpoint, it was irritating to have adventures where the PC's "watched" the event with no input, but from Novel or RPG standpoint, it's irritating to have to buy every book to even know what's happening. DL is even worse with it, and the latest DL novels drove me away forever. Not only do they change constantly, but the quality is horrid IMO.

 

[Arnwyn]

[sblock]

real nice. But even in that other thread, I don't see anything that indicates WotC gets the money, and in this you don't answer how the Canadian stores can discount if they're paying the higher price. I don't throw around my profession on the internet, since it doesn't really matter. Saying you're a professional accountant doesn't mean anything when you don't put information of use in the posts.

Thanks - it was nice. I did put information of use - I think what you mean is "detail that (you) want to see". But I'm not going to bother going into that - my original response was simply a nice little aside to simply point out that the "ask your government" comment isn't really correct. People can "refute" if they want to (though obviously no one has), but it doesn't really matter. *shrug*

As for some (basic) answers (I'm not doing the research again):
"I don't see anything that indicates WotC gets the money": If WotC is considered the publisher, then they do. My local paper (McNally is from here) went into some of the details at the time. I said as much in the old post.

How Cdn stores can discount: Beats me, but some do. As I alluded to in the old post, hardcovers are discounted more often than softcovers; also, certain stores discount certain books. For example, the larger book retailers will discount hardcover novels fairly often, but never D&D books. Conversely, the LGSs in my area (though from posts at ENWorld, not others) give us a much better rate than what's listed on the D&D book. It is likely due to the booksellers purchasing at a moment in time in which the exchange rate in Canada is fairly high, and purchasing at the US price - thus resulting in a lower cost for the booksellers than what the printed Cdn price says. These savings are then passed on to consumers in Canada (for whatever reason - that business decision I'm not privy to). In other words, Cdn retailers aren't (necessarily) purchasing at the higher (listed book) price.[/sblock]

I grew tired of it as a novel fan AND an RPG fan myself. I ditched FR for GH years ago, and now embrace Eberron. (And, somewhat fear some of the Eberron novels, they seem willing to involve "grand events" in each one, but luckily they're all localized and don't affect the world at large.)

Yeah, I don't blame you. Good to hear about Eberron - hopefully there were some 'lessons learned' when it comes to novels in that setting.

From an RPG standpoint, it was irritating to have adventures where the PC's "watched" the event with no input, but from Novel or RPG standpoint, it's irritating to have to buy every book to even know what's happening. DL is even worse with it, and the latest DL novels drove me away forever. Not only do they change constantly, but the quality is horrid IMO.

I am totally with you there. I suspect that the novel reading population doesn't really care about "what's happening", though. They just see "Forgotten Realms" and buy it because they've liked other "Forgotten Realms" books. What we consider to be lame 'RSEs' might be exciting to the casual buyer. (Just a suspicion, though. I do know many complete non-gamers who buy FR novels just like others buy Tom Clancy novels - they aren't even aware that FR is some sort of game world. Whether that's representative or not is beyond me...)

 

[Eela6]

I'd like to point out that unlike FR novels, Eberron novels are all non-canon. You can put them in your game if you want, but there's no metaplot - Eberron stays at 998 YK.

 

[Vocenoctum]

"I don't see anything that indicates WotC gets the money": If WotC is considered the publisher, then they do. My local paper (McNally is from here) went into some of the details at the time. I said as much in the old post.

I think the issue isn't who the publisher is, but who the distributor is to Canada. If a publisher ships directly to a Canadian distributor (or is their own) then the percentage is based on Canadian price. If they instead ship to a US distributor that then ships to Canada & the US, the price is most likely based on % of US price. Either way contracts are negotiated and I doubt even a Canadian distributor would negotiate based on the higher Canadian price. It may be that the Canadian corporate side of things is doing the gouging, or not. Most such reports are based on larger booksellers than WotC, most of which probably run their own Canadian subsidiaries.

Yeah, I don't blame you. Good to hear about Eberron - hopefully there were some 'lessons learned' when it comes to novels in that setting.

I think the main presentation problem with Eberron is that folks think the "different" elements are more pervasive than they are. Warforged aren't common, the Lightning Rail only connects a handful of major cities, Air Ships are expensive and uncommon. (Heck, FR has airships anyway.) This is perpetuated by Dungeon and the novel staff, and WotC seems to forget their own advice in highlighting what's different rather than what's the same.

(Heck, I used Warforged in a Ravenloft game, they were Soulforged, it was the custom of Nova Vaasa or Falkovnia, I forget which, for fallen warriors to give themselves over to be eternal guardians. Like Karrnathi Skeletons.)

 

[Troll Wizard]

I think the issue isn't who the publisher is, but who the distributor is to Canada. If a publisher ships directly to a Canadian distributor (or is their own) then the percentage is based on Canadian price. If they instead ship to a US distributor that then ships to Canada & the US, the price is most likely based on % of US price. Either way contracts are negotiated and I doubt even a Canadian distributor would negotiate based on the higher Canadian price. It may be that the Canadian corporate side of things is doing the gouging, or not. Most such reports are based on larger booksellers than WotC, most of which probably run their own Canadian subsidiaries.

You are pretty much spot on that the distributors (and the larger retail chains) are the ones that "assist" WOTC in setting the MSRP of their products. Based on past comments by WOTC and even third party publishers we know:

1. Lords of Madness name change
2. D20 Modern, down to 4 softcovers, WOTC had wanted 2 hardcovers, but the distributors would not stock it. (pretty much dead now IMO)
3. Distributor preference for hardcover books over softcover
4. Distributor preference for $5 price increments ($24.99, 29.99, 34.99)
5. Preference for less SKUs, i.e. why WOTC minis are so popular with the distributors and retailers, and the fast dollar turn overs helps

I am sure that the Canadian distributors ask for (or perhaps demand) a bump in the MSRP, in order to cover the exchange rate difference. Remember the exchange does vary and since the books are often completed months in advance and the distributors have to place their orders at a minimum 2-3 months in advance, they want to cover their investment in case of a sudden plunge in the canadian dollar.

 

[Knightfall]

More like QF...WTF? CAD's trading against USD @ 0.875 - sounds like Wizards is just out of touch with the exchange rate.

Well, I didn't know it was that close. What the hell?