New_class_idea: Combat Engineer (need feedback)

[Beta]

Engineer
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Role: Striker/Controller
Power Source: Technology, your Rig grants you ability (see Class Features)
Key Abilities: INT, CON
Armor Proficiencies: Cloth, Leather, Hide, Light Shield.
Weapon Proficiencies: Simple Melee, Simple ranged.
Bonus to Defense: +1 Will, +1 Fortitude

Hit Points at 1st Level: 10 + CON
Hit Points per Level Gained: 4
Healing Surges Per Day: 4 + CON
Trained Skills: Diplomacy, Dungeoneering, History, Religion
Build Options: Explosive Bolt, Searing Spear
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Class Features:
Engineer's Rig: The Rig is the Engineer's substitute for a weapon or an implement. It consists of a primary offensive element and multiple secondary elements can be expanded upon. The Rig consumes more weight as it is equipped with ammunition and powers. Rig ammunition can stockpiled off-Rig and stored in a safe place. Rigs can be enchanted in the same manner as staffs, but they are not able to use staff Powers. The base of a Rig is placed on the back.

Primary Offensive Element (choose only 1):
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Explosive Bolt Build 14 lbs (total base Rig weight)[/FONT]
Searing Spear Build 10 lbs [FONT=Times New Roman, serif](total base Rig weight)[/FONT]

Secondary Elements are only added to the rig if their corresponding power is used, if the element is removed the powers associated with the element can no longer be used.
Element | Max Ammunition Equipped | Associated Powers | Weight Cost
Grenade Rack [max 10 Grenades] (Grenade Throw, Shielded Grenade Toss) 2 lbs
Explosive Bracer Harness [max 1 Explosive Bracer Pack] (Explosive Bracer) 20 lbs
Rocket Volley Rack [max 1 Rocket Volley] (Rocket Volley) 4 lbs

Rig Ammunition:
Explosive Bolt (20) 2 lbs
Searing Spear (10) 4 lbs
Grenade (1) 1 lbs
Fire Retardant Applicator Pack (1) 1 lbs
Fire Javelin Main (1) 4 lbs
Fire Javelin Burner (10) 4 lbs
Explosive Bracer Pack (1) 2 lbs
Jaw Trap (1) 6 lbs
Cannon Spear (10) 4 lbs

Shield hand free
Engineers are proficient in using light shields. While holding these shields they are able to manipulate objects using the same hand.

Rig hand
Explosive Bolt Build has weapon hand free to hold another item.
Spearing Spear Build uses weapon hand.

(special note: Technology is written in the same vein as "Divine","Martial","Arcane","Primal",etc)
(special note: New ammunition can be loaded into the Rig as a minor action per element loaded, all ammunition can be created while resting for at least 2 hours using an ammunition creation kit 10 lbs)
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Explosive Bolt Engineer Attack 1
At-Will <> Technology Rig Fire
Standard A[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]ction Ranged 10/20 (Hand Crossbow)[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]
[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Target:[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif] One creature[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Attack: INT +2 vs AC[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Hit: 1d4 Damage and 1d6 + INT Fire Damage [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Special: [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Requires Explosive Bolt Build. [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]This power counts as a ranged basic attack. When a power allows you to make a ranged basic attack, you can use this power.[/FONT] [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Depletes 1 Rig ammunition of type Explosive Bolts, after 20 depletions must spend [/FONT]a Standard Action to reload prior to using the power again.

Searing Spear Engineer Attack 1
At-Will <> Technology Rig Fire
Standard Action Melee 1
Target: One creature
Attack: INT +2 vs AC
Hit: 1d6 Damage and 1d6 + INT Fire Damage
Special: Requires Searing Spear build. [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]This power counts as a melee basic attack. When a power allows you to make a melee basic attack, you can use this power. Depletes 1 Rig ammunition of type Searing Spear at the end of the encounter, no more than 1 ammunition of this type can be depleted per encounter.[/FONT]

Grenade Throw Engineer Attack 1
At-Will <> Technology Rig Fire
Standard Action Area burst 1 Ranged 10
Target: Every creature in burst
Attack: INT vs Reflex
Hit: 1d6 + INT Fire Damage
Special: Depletes 1 Rig ammunition of type Grenade.

Shielded Grenade Toss Engineer Attack 1
At-Will <> Technology Rig Fire
Minor Action Area burst 1 Melee 1
Target: Every other creature in burst
Attack: INT vs Reflex
Hit: 1d6 + INT Fire Damage
Special: Requires Grenade Throw. Requires a shield. Doesn't provoke an opportunity attack. Depletes 1 Rig ammunition of type Grenade. This ability does not provoke an opportunity attack.


Throw Fire Javelin Engineer Attack 1
Encounter <> Technology Rig Fire
Standard Action Ranged 10
Target: One creature
Attack: INT vs Reflex
Hit: 2d8 + INT Fire Damage and ongoing 5 Fire damage (save ends)
Special: Depletes 1 Rig ammunition of type Fire Javelin Burner. If the Fire Javelin is not picked up again, depletes 1 Rig ammunition of type Fire Javelin Main.

Searing Aggression Engineer Attack 1
Encounter <> Technology Rig Fire
Standard Action Melee 1
Effect: Shift up to 3 squares before attacking
Target: One creature
Attack: INT vs AC
Hit: 2d6 Damage and 1d6 + INT Fire Damage
Special: Requires Searing Spear. [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Depletes 1 Rig ammunition of type Searing Spear at the end of the encounter, no more than 1 ammunition of this type can be depleted per encounter.[/FONT]


Explosive Bracer Engineer Utility 2
Daily <> Technology
Move Action Personal
Effect: Move vertically 6 squares and horizontally up to movement speed +1 squares. If nothing can prevent falling, fall until fall is broken. Take 1d6 damage for every 2 squares fallen.
Special: Depletes 1 Rig ammunition of type Explosive Bracer Pack.

Fire Retardant Applicator Engineer Utility 2
Daily <> Technology
Standard Action Personal
Effect: User is granted 5 additional Fire resistance. This resistance is depleted after 40 points of Fire damage have been resisted.
Special: This resistance is triggered before other resistances take effect. Depletes 1 Rig ammunition of type Fire Retardant Applicator Pack. Cannot be used in combat.


Jaw Trap Throw Engineer Attack 3
Encounter <> Technology Rig
Standard Action Ranged 5
Target: One creature
Attack: INT vs Reflex
Hit: 1d10 + INT damage and target is slowed (save ends)
Special: If the Jaw Trap is not picked up again, depletes 1 Rig ammunition of type Jaw Trap.

Cannon Spear Engineer Attack 3
Encounter <> Technology Rig Fire
Standard Action Ranged 20
Target: One creature
Attack: INT vs Reflex
Hit: 2d8 + INT Damage and 1d6 Fire Damage
Special: Depletes 1 Rig ammunition of type Cannon Spear.


Rocket Volley Engineer Attack 5
Daily <> Technology Rig Fire
Standard Action Area burst 2 Ranged 20
Target: Every creature in burst
Attack: INT vs Reflex
Hit: 4d6 Fire Damage and ongoing 5 Fire damage (save ends)
Miss: Half Damage. No ongoing damage
Hit or Miss: Inflict Daze until start of next turn
Special: Depletes 1 Rig ammunition of type Rocket Volley.


Air Control Engineer Utility 6
Daily <> Technology
Standard Action Personal
Effect: Deploy wind powered glider. Allow rider of the glider to begin flight in windy conditions. Fly at wind speed.
Special: Requires a glider kit that weighs 30 lbs, glider can be packed back up into kit if it doesn't crash.


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Extra question: Does making Shielded Grenade Toss a minor action make it too powerful even when taking into consideration that the maximum grenades that can be used in an encounter is 10?
Extra question: What is a good striker ability?

 

[BendBars/LiftGates]

I think you need to really read up on the mechanics of the other classes before you add this to your game. Personally, it seems wildly anachronistic to me, and the mechanics are far off.

The class fits none of the four party roles or any of the power sources, and thus it adds mess to the game. The powers use none of the language of the game rules. For example, the word "create" is confusing in this context; powers shouldn't have weights; the body slot subsystem is unsatisfyingly explained; hit points don't count towards specific damage types; and no one saves for half damage anymore. These are the sorts of lapses in mechanical viability that prevent anyone from assessing the balance or merits of this class.

It just doesn't resemble any class from the game, and to be brutally honest that's likely why there aren't any responses. I don't know what to make of this.

 

[Beta]

I updated my original posting to reflect your comments, although I am curious what in particular is the most "anachronistic" element.

 

[WYT]

What a wonderful idea! Maybe we could create a new power source called Technology. With that, we could create some new classes related to 4e roles, for example:

Tech Striker: Engineer
Tech Defender: Someone with machine parts in his body.
Tech Controller: Someone that creates and fights with wooden steam bots.
Tech Leader: Someone aiding allies and putting conditions on enemies with bizarre machines.

 

[CapnZapp]

The idea has potential, but the execution is far from complete. So far, in fact I agree it's all but impossible to comment (without doing your work for you).

My best advice to you is to go back to the drawing board, and then posting a new thread when you have a class that follows the spirit as well as the rule of fourth edition. However, you don't need to complete the class all the way up to level 30 before soliciting feedback.

Good luck!

 

[Beta]

What is the spirit of 4e?

 

[HouseVigilante]

What a wonderful idea! Maybe we could create a new power source called Technology. With that, we could create some new classes related to 4e roles, for example:

Tech Striker: Engineer
Tech Defender: Someone with machine parts in his body.
Tech Controller: Someone that creates and fights with wooden steam bots.
Tech Leader: Someone aiding allies and putting conditions on enemies with bizarre machines.

I'm used to 3.5 more than 4E, and am a relatively inexperienced player so someone else will probably have to do the pencil work on this one, unless I get a wild hair.

Tech Defender sounds like a perfect class for a Warforged, perhaps some work could be put into taking the racial features and transferring them into a character class.

Tech Controller or Tech Leader: One word: Artificer. We had a PC in one of our 3.5 campaigns who performed all sorts of madness with a Gnomish Artificer who was addicted to Potions of Speed. Yes, it was hilarious.

-Corinne
Map Vixen and Resource Dilettante, House Vigilante

 

[ghearus]

Some Suggestions

Here is a bit of an overhaul, but a touch more balanced. What do you think?

Engineer
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Role: Controller
Power Source: Martial; Your alchemical and technical expertise grants you the ability to dominate the battlefield, though some of your powers make striker a natural secondary role.
Key Abilities: Strength, Dexterity, Intelligence,
Armor Proficiencies: Cloth
Weapon Proficiencies: Simple Ranged, Polearms, Grenade
Implement: Rig
Bonus to Defense: +1 Fortitude, +1 Reflex

Hit Points at 1st Level: 10 + Constitution
Hit Points per Level Gained: 4
Healing Surges per Day: 4 + Constitution

Trained Skills: Diplomacy, From the class skills below, choose three more.
Build Options: Demolitionist, Artillerist
Class Features: Lancer, Engineers Rig, Offensive Tactic, Create Ammunition Ritual


Engineer Class Features
LancerEngineers are able to wield an Engineer’s Lance as a two handed weapon while using their rigs to fire crossbows or launch grenades. This class feature grants the Deploy Lance and Stow Lance feats.
Engineer RigEngineers can wear and use a rig, and use the weaponry. See the Rig description for more information.
Combat Alchemy

You have experience handling unstable alchemical compounds in battle.
Offensive Tactics
Choose one of Grenadier, Arbalist, Armored Guardian tactical options and gain its benefit:
Grenadier
Grenadiers gain Far Throw as a feat and can draw Grenades as a free action.
Arbalist
Arbalists gain Far Shot as a feat, and treat Hand Crossbows as off-hand weapons.
Armored Guardian

Gain Armored Rig as a feat.
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Engineer Powers


Class Features

Deploy Lance

At-Will <> Martial, Implement, Stance
Minor Action, Personal
Your Engineers Lance becomes deployed and available for attacks.
Stow Lance

At-Will <> Martial, Implement, Stance
Minor Action, Personal
Your Engineers Lance is stowed, and not available for attacks.
Level 1 At-will Powers
Long Shot Engineer Attack 1
At-Will <> Martial, Weapon
Standard Action Ranged Weapon + 5
Requirement: You must be using a crossbow
Target: One creature
Attack: Dex vs AC
Hit: 1[W] + Int force damage
Arbalist: If your engineers lance is not deployed, you may use this as a Ranged Basic attack.

Hobbling Strike Attack 1
At-Will <> Martial, Weapon
Standard Action Melee
Requirement: You must be using a Polearm
Target: One creature
Attack: Strength vs Fortitude
Hit: 1 [W] damage + Int damage and the target becomes slowed until the end of your next turn.
Special: If your Engineers Lance is not deployed, you may not use it for this attack.

Grenade Toss Engineer Attack 1
At-Will <> Martial, Alchemical
Standard Action Burst 1 within Grenade Range
Requirement: This power can only be used with a grenade.
Target: One creature
Attack: Dex vs Reflex
Hit: Deal 1[W] + Int force damage to the target, and
Grenadier: If your Engineers Lance is not deployed, gain the following: increase the range of this attack by your strength bonus, this attack does not provoke attacks of opportunity.

Defensive Blast Engineer Attack 1
At-Will <> Martial, Alchemical, Weapon
Standard Action Close Burst 1
Target: Each creature in burst
Attack: Strength vs Will
Hit: 1[W] + Int
Effect: The target becomes deafened until the beginning of your next turn.
Armored Guardian:.The first time this is used in an encounter all affected become dazed until the beginning of your next turn.
New Equipment

Rigs
A rig is a specialized suit of armour worn over clothing. Anyone with the appropriate armour feats can wear a Rig, but without the Engineer’s Rig class feature, the wearer takes -5 penalty to Reflex, Initiative, all Dexterity based attacks, and all Dexterity based skills. Rigs can be enchanted with one Armour enchantment. The mounted crossbow can also receive a single separate enchantment that is effectively a separate item for all mechanical purposes.
Rig, Armor Bonus, Check, Speed, Price, Weight, Properties
Basic Rig, 0, 0, 0, 5gp, 9lbs, Considered Cloth Armor
Leatherguard Rig, 2, 0, 0, 30, 20lbs, Light Rig, Considered Leather Armor
Hideguard Rig, 3, -1, 0, 35, 30 lbs, Light Rig, Considered Hide Armor
Chainguard Rig, 6, -1, -1, 45, 45 lb, Armoured Rig, Considered Chainmail Armor
Scaleguard Rig, 7, 0, -1, 50, 50 lbs, Armoured Rig, Considered Scale Armor
Plateguard Rig, 8, -1, -1, 55, 55 lbs, Heavy Rig, Considered Plate Armor
Engineers Lance
An engineer’s lance is any polearm that has been broken in two parts, and reworked for deployment on a rig. The Engineers Lance is a template that can be applied to any Polearm, and can be enchanted with any Polearm enchantment.
Engineers Lance (Weapon Template): increase the cost by 5 gp; retain the proficiency bonus, Damage, Weight, Groups, and Properties of the original polearm.
Alchemical Grenade
An Alchemical Grenade is a light thrown weapon. If handled out of combat by someone without Combat Alchemy, roll 1d10; on a roll of 1, the grenade is activated with the handler as the target. In combat, roll 1d10, and on anything except a 1, the grenade explodes centered on the handler, dealing 1d6 damage per tier. When used with an Alchemical power, the burst effect gains the benefit of the grenade. Alchemical Grenades weigh 1lb.
Grenade, Cost, Level, Effect
Basic Grenade, 1sp, 1, Deals Force damage
Fire Grenade, 1gp, 5, Deals Fire Damage, Grants +1 to burst damage
Acid Grenade, 1gp, 5, Deals Acid Damage, Grants +1 to burst damage
Shocking Grenade, 1gp, 5, Deals Lighting Damage, Grants +1 to burst damage
Glue Grenade, 5gp, 10, slows burst targets until end of next turn
Firebomb Grenade, 10gp, 15, Deals Fire Damage, Grants +2 to burst damage, increase size of burst by 1
Acidburst Grenade, 10gp, 15, Deals Acid Damage, Grants +2 to burst damage, increase size of burst by 1
Shockstorm Grenade, 10gp, 15, Deals Lighting Damage, Grants +2 to burst damage, increase size of burst by 1
Binding Bomb, 100gp, 20, immobilizes burst targets (save ends)
Fireblast Grenade, 1000gp, 25, Fire, Grants +3 to burst damage, increase size of burst by 2
Acidcloud Grenade, 1000gp, 25, Grants +3 to burst damage, increase size of burst by 2
StormArc Grenade, 1000gp, 25, Grants +3 to burst damage, increase size of burst by 2
Feats

Light Rig TrainingGain the ability to wear Light Rigs; Requires the Rig Training class feature and Strength 12.
Armoured Rig TrainingGain the ability to wear Armoured Rigs; Requires the Rig Training class feature and Strength 14.
Heavy Rig TrainingGain the ability to wear Heavy Rigs; Requires the Rig Training class feature and Strength 16.

 

[Beta]

Wow! That's really great what you've come up with. It meshes with the game very nicely and seems quite balanced. Your Rig and Grenade tables are great and the builds are good!

A+++!