No Overrun as Part of a Charge?

[the Jester]

According to Brain, the 3.5 PH errata removes the ability to perform an overrun as part of a charge. (Haven't checked this myself, but I believe him- we were discussing a character he's making for my epic game, and this bit of errata works against him.)

Why?

Is there something overwhelming that I'm missing about being able to overrun one enemy in order to get at another? Is there a combo I'm unaware of or something?

Anyone have any info on the reasoning behind this?

 

[Brisk-sg]

I was looking through the FAQ and Errata last night and I saw something about this, and was irritated by it as well. There is not much that Overrun is good for if you cannot use it in a charge in my opinion.

The Errata does say this, and it is mentioned in the FAQ as well in relation to mounted combat. It doesn't say why this was changed though.

In your game, if you don't like the errata I would probally change it back to how it is stated in the book. The problems with it probally stem from feats in the splat books, I seem to remember sword and fist having an overrun feat that gave you an attack or some such. I could see some abusive situation there.

 

[AuraSeer]

The description of the Charge action says that you can't charge through a space occupied by an ally. However, as originally written, that stipulation was meaningless because you could just declare an Overrun on the ally as part of the charge action. The ally would presumably choose to avoid you, meaning that you could charge through allies without trouble.

Disallowing overruns during a charge was the most obvious way to remove that contradiction. It wasn't the only possibility, clearly, but it's the one WOTC thought of first.

 

[Starglim]

The description of the Charge action says that you can't charge through a space occupied by an ally. However, as originally written, that stipulation was meaningless because you could just declare an Overrun on the ally as part of the charge action. The ally would presumably choose to avoid you, meaning that you could charge through allies without trouble.

Disallowing overruns during a charge was the most obvious way to remove that contradiction. It wasn't the only possibility, clearly, but it's the one WOTC thought of first.

I'd much rather remove the contradiction by making it harder for the defender to avoid the overrun, say, by requiring a Reflex save. As it is, the errata quashes reasonable and historical tactics, and causes severe problems to Ride-By Attack.

 

[Malin Genie]

I agree that the only real point of Overrun is as part of a Charge (to get past the weedy minion blocking the way to the BBEG.) I could even see a ruling that if the minion wants to get in your way that you spend your action knocking him down and can't also make an attack, but it seems kind of strange that even if he lets you through you couldn't then complete your Charge....

Doesn't the description of Overrun even state that you get a +2 bonus if the attempt is made as part of a Charge?

 

[Chronosome]

Interesting, if true, Auraseer.

I'd just have it so you still can't charge through a buddy's square, and therefore can't Overrun if you're trying to do so. Otherwise, charge-and-topple all you like.

 

[the Jester]

Aha, the friendly square! Now I see the (admittedly flawed) reasoning here.

Right, time to house rule...