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No tracking?
- Thread starter Flobby
- Start date
GnomeWorks
Adventurer
Tracking is part of Perception, in 4e. No feat required.
Rabbitbait
Grog-nerd
My understanding is that tracking is now best done as a skill challenge.
In the wilderness, perception and nature would be the key skills (which makes the ranger well suited to it). In urban areas it would be perception and streetwise (favouring the rogue). Underground it would be perception and dungeoncraft (favouring ??? - I don't have the books yet so I can't look it up.)
As a skill check it also means that you can do the challange over several days without it being simply 10 tracking checks - the players can think creatively to find better ways of catching up with whoever they are following.
I like it!
In the wilderness, perception and nature would be the key skills (which makes the ranger well suited to it). In urban areas it would be perception and streetwise (favouring the rogue). Underground it would be perception and dungeoncraft (favouring ??? - I don't have the books yet so I can't look it up.)
As a skill check it also means that you can do the challange over several days without it being simply 10 tracking checks - the players can think creatively to find better ways of catching up with whoever they are following.
I like it!
Flobby said:
Only the Ranger and the Rogue get Perception as a class skill (ie. they don't have to spend a feat to get it at first level). And only the Ranger and the Wizard get nature as a class skill.
So if you want to argue for a nice synergy between the skills without having to spend one or more feats, the Ranger is the man for the job and no one else.
Graethynne
First Post
re: ways to tweak tracking
I started a thread here http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=230478
to discuss ways to deepen the skills outside of skill challenges.
It was actually sparked by my sadness about the loss of track (and certain other things PCs could do in 3.x - don't get me wrong though, I am a huge 4e fan, was playing all afternoon actually).
Feel free to share your thoughts.
Graydon
I started a thread here http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=230478
to discuss ways to deepen the skills outside of skill challenges.
It was actually sparked by my sadness about the loss of track (and certain other things PCs could do in 3.x - don't get me wrong though, I am a huge 4e fan, was playing all afternoon actually).
Feel free to share your thoughts.
Graydon
I was actually curious on how you could make a good tracking skill encounter.
Of course the skill challenge example in the book is the most obvious and easiest to build challenge (diplomacy) and is not very helpful as an example goes. Also for some reason all the PCs made their rolls successfully, and when their initiative came up they had the right skill for the job, and the challenge is linear. Not very representative.
For instance, if you're just following a trail, and the only person with good perception is the ranger... what does everyone else do on their turns? For this example let us say we do not have a rogue.
Now, skill challenges are supposed to be pushed along by the PCs right? So what if you wanted to introduce things like enemy scouts and avoiding them (stealth) and overcoming obstacles like mountains or streams.
Do I prompt the PCs to make these checks, or do they have to just BS a reason why I should allow them to make an atheltics check for example?
Obviously someone will need to be using Perception (track) and Nature (environmental dangers) every round, but... besides that unless I tell the PCs what their problems are they don't really have anything else to roll. If the Ranger has the only good Nature and Perception, he has to let someone else roll the other right?
Sure, I can think of uses for most of the skills...
Insight - Avoid being tricked by having you go around in circles on the trail
Stealth - Avoid a group of scouts who are on the look out through this territory (though if you fail doesn't that sort of... start a fight?)
Athletics, swim rivers, climb obstacles, failure and you have to go around.
Acrobatics - get across a broken rope bridge and repair it, if you fail you go around.
Endurance: Bad weather. Lose a healing surge.
But when do I ask for these checks, or do I just let them roll any skill they feel like and find a reason for it? And if they didn't roll that skill... then it wouldn't of come up?
Does anyone have a good example of a tracking skill challenge?
It kind of seems it would be easier if they didn't roll initiative for this.
Of course the skill challenge example in the book is the most obvious and easiest to build challenge (diplomacy) and is not very helpful as an example goes. Also for some reason all the PCs made their rolls successfully, and when their initiative came up they had the right skill for the job, and the challenge is linear. Not very representative.
For instance, if you're just following a trail, and the only person with good perception is the ranger... what does everyone else do on their turns? For this example let us say we do not have a rogue.
Now, skill challenges are supposed to be pushed along by the PCs right? So what if you wanted to introduce things like enemy scouts and avoiding them (stealth) and overcoming obstacles like mountains or streams.
Do I prompt the PCs to make these checks, or do they have to just BS a reason why I should allow them to make an atheltics check for example?
Obviously someone will need to be using Perception (track) and Nature (environmental dangers) every round, but... besides that unless I tell the PCs what their problems are they don't really have anything else to roll. If the Ranger has the only good Nature and Perception, he has to let someone else roll the other right?
Sure, I can think of uses for most of the skills...
Insight - Avoid being tricked by having you go around in circles on the trail
Stealth - Avoid a group of scouts who are on the look out through this territory (though if you fail doesn't that sort of... start a fight?)
Athletics, swim rivers, climb obstacles, failure and you have to go around.
Acrobatics - get across a broken rope bridge and repair it, if you fail you go around.
Endurance: Bad weather. Lose a healing surge.
But when do I ask for these checks, or do I just let them roll any skill they feel like and find a reason for it? And if they didn't roll that skill... then it wouldn't of come up?
Does anyone have a good example of a tracking skill challenge?
It kind of seems it would be easier if they didn't roll initiative for this.
AntiPaladin
First Post
Call me crazy but I was ecstatic to see the demise of the "class specific" feats/abilities in 4E. Rogue trapfinding and ranger tracking were roadblocks to creative character creation in my experience. I think it is much better to use a skill based approach, which also encourages multiclassing just like the last edition.
Great change, perception is rogue/ranger only by default but there are several ways to gain training in it. Classes should feel special for reasons besides, "Only x class gets y ability (trapfinding!)"
Great change, perception is rogue/ranger only by default but there are several ways to gain training in it. Classes should feel special for reasons besides, "Only x class gets y ability (trapfinding!)"
