On Indigenous Peoples Day Coyote & Crow pdf will be pay what you want

[BookTenTiger]

The way it is framed is definitely racist. And much of it reads like a struggle session to boot

Is there a definition of "struggle session" different than the one I'm googling about Maoist China?

 

[Bedrockgames]

Is there a definition of "struggle session" different than the one I'm googling about Maoist China?

That is what I was using as an analogy of a mindset. I was not saying this was identical to a Maoist struggle session but I think it is easy to see the link to the current idea you are invoking (especially since that idea you talk about doesn't exist in a vacuum and where it get used elsewhere in society presently is looking much closer to actual struggle sessions---minus the violence)

 

[Cordwainer Fish]

Is there a definition of "struggle session" different than the one I'm googling about Maoist China?

Doesn't it mean "go ahead and block me, reading my posts will never improve your life"? Because that's what I do when someone uses it in earnest.

 

[BookTenTiger]

That is what I was using as an analogy of a mindset. I was not saying this was identical to a Maoist struggle session but I think it is easy to see the link to the current idea you are invoking (especially since that idea you talk about doesn't exist in a vacuum and where it get used elsewhere in society presently is looking much closer to actual struggle sessions---minus the violence)

Dude, that's just not the way I want to talk about a really fascinating roleplaying game. Please keep in mind that this thread is about a game by indigenous creators being released for pay-what-you-want on Indigenous People's Day, and what you are focusing on is one small section of the book that's asking people to play respectfully. You are bringing in pretty loaded language, comparing this guidance to public displays of humiliation and violence.

I'm always up for talking about history, culture, and roleplaying games, but please leave out loaded analogies. This single page is not marching you out into the street or threatening your livelihood or life. It's, quite simply, inappropriate to be comparing it to practices like that.

 

[Bedrockgames]

Dude, that's just not the way I want to talk about a really fascinating roleplaying game. Please keep in mind that this thread is about a game by indigenous creators being released for pay-what-you-want on Indigenous People's Day, and what you are focusing on is one small section of the book that's asking people to play respectfully. You are bringing in pretty loaded language, comparing this guidance to public displays of humiliation and violence.

I'm always up for talking about history, culture, and roleplaying games, but please leave out loaded analogies. This single page is not marching you out into the street or threatening your livelihood or life. It's, quite simply, inappropriate to be comparing it to practices like that.

Fair enough. I think the analogy is apt to your point, the sentiment on the webpage and to your point about discomfort. On the other hand, I am invoking a very potent historical example to make my point (I have always been fascinated by Communist China, The Khmer Rouge and Soviet Russia-----so the cultural revolution just has struck me as relevant to some current trends the way some find the rise of the Third Reich relevant to some current trends: it is about how it rhymes, not that it is identical). But it is charged. It is hyperbolic. I do think the intro is doing more than what you say above, but I don't think this of us who disagree about that will resolve our disagreement in this thread. And I don't want to bog down the thread as I have already made my points and we are just hashing over them in detail now. And my issues aren't with this book in particular, I am just have a lot of misgivings and unease about the direction things have been going in the hobby and in the culture when it comes to things like entertainment and the arts. So I am finding it harder and harder not to say my feelings clearly when these topics crop up (because I genuinely feel we are going in a bad and dangerous direction, however well intentioned). But probably not worth wading in every time it does emerge in a thread

 

[aramis erak]

You don’t get to tell people what they can and can’t do at a game table

The authorial team felt they had the right to do so.

Most game designers do to some extent. After all, game rules are just a program for the first man-made computer - the human brain.

 

[Bedrockgames]

The authorial team felt they had the right to do so.

Most game designers do to some extent. After all, game rules are just a program for the first man-made computer - the human brain.

Again I am going to depart from this thread (see my previous post). But to clarify my point was about the 'ought' in the posters remark.A designer can say whatever they want in an intro. A poster can make any request or demand they want. Whether that request or demand has moral weight, has a justified 'ought' is a whole other matter. In this case, I was saying the poster doesn't have the moral justification to make a demand about what people do at the gaming table (that person can tell people to game however they want, but people are free to ignore it, and I think justified in doing so).

 

[Umbran]

And much of it reads like a struggle session to boot

Mod Note:
Likening this to violent Maoist spectacles is out of perspective, insulting, and makes this political. On all counts, unacceptable.

The next time you want to join a discussion about such matters, please keep your rhetoric in check. You are done in this one.

 

[Autumnal]

I admit it: I wasn’t really expecting to want to expand my ignore list in this thread. But then I wasn’t expecting some of the weirdly intense responses, either.

Meanwhile, the actual game remains interesting to browse. The setting does something I like a lot: it’s a good place to live, but it takes constant work to keep it that way, so the PCs can be part of a constructive ongoing project. Even a grumpy old grimdark fan like me appreciates that.