Once per day non-magical effects destroy suspension of disbelief

[IanArgent]

I really would have preferred an Iron Heroes or combo based system. Having a feint leading into powerful attack just feels like more fun for me. For teamwork fun, have the combo work for two synced people (feat). Warlord slashes right, knocking aside the enemies sword, Fighter slashes left. The rogue runs up the fighters back, leaps at the BBEG with knife outstretched and his protection down.

Too much work for too little effect. the At-will/encounter/daily power economy gets most of that without needing any book/token-keeping.

 

[williamhm]

It is a game first and formost. They had to do something to balance the classes, and this was the easiest most effective way to do it. Frankly I dont have a problem with it.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

If I wanted to play an action movie game, I'd be playing Feng Shui... where I do believe I can whip out my best moves any time I want to.

Well, if you prefer. I read the Feng Shui book many years ago, and found it quite interesting, but I think the mechanics are a bit to simplistic in the end.
4E seems to offer still a lot of variety and place for tinkering, if I feel like it.

 

[Atropos]

If I wanted to play an action movie game, I'd be playing Feng Shui...

An awesome game, too, but not suitable for all types of action movies, just the Hongkong-style ones.

where I do believe I can whip out my best moves any time I want to.

You cannot. Feng Shui also have a ressource management system for martial arts powers, called Chi. If you're out of Chi, you don't get to "whip out your best moves".

 

[Gort]

For anyone who missed the post's original context (i.e. signature):



Cheers, -- N

Thanks Nifft. It kinda ruined the first page of the thread when the OP got embarrassed and changed it.

 

[hong]

Trying to have it both ways or misunderstanding my reply?

I am having it both ways, of course. This is the beauty of having an abstract combat system, whereby defeating an opponent can be described in various ways that all share the same outcome of the guy ending up in a heap on the ground.

I'm saying that NO, the exploits I mentioned are not usable once per day with one success, but are instead usable once per day regardless of success or failure.

Which is contrary to your assertion in post #162.

The in-game effect of beating up a bad guy is usable as many times per day as you defeat bad guys. It just so happens that some daily specific powers can only be used once per day.

This isn't the tripping thread, its the one about general non-magical 1/day exploits and their impact on suspension of disbelief.

So its not about whether you can achieve the same results by a variety of maneuvers, but whether it makes sense that certain exploits are limited to 1/day.

It makes complete sense that certain exploits are limited to 1/day, on the assumption that certain types of bad guys will be met 1/day.

Which is what happens in action movies.

 

[hong]

If I wanted to play an action movie game, I'd be playing Feng Shui... where I do believe I can whip out my best moves any time I want to.

Why play Feng Shui when you can play D&D and do the same thing?

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

It just so happens that some daily specific powers can only be used once per day.

Which doesn't make sense in the specific cases cited. Let's go around the circle again?

It makes complete sense that certain exploits are limited to 1/day, on the assumption that certain types of bad guys will be met 1/day.

Which is what happens in action movies.

Again, not the ones I cited.

 

[hong]

Which doesn't make sense in the specific cases cited.

It makes complete sense, once you let go of the notion that a specific in-game action must be mapped to a specific metagame mechanic.

Let's go around the circle again?

If you insist.

Again, not the ones I cited.

Watch better action movies.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

It makes complete sense, once you let go of the notion that a specific in-game action must be mapped to a specific metagame mechanic.

No, not really. If they wanted that, they shouldn't have provided the reality-jarring descriptions. There is simply no logical reason why the maneuvers lumped together as the exploit "Villain's Menace" (and others) should be 1/day.

Watch better action movies.

Pick any action movie you want- modern or old, American or International- odds are good that at there will be multiple uses of what would be simulated by one of the 1/day non reliable exploits more often than that.