Other Variant Player's Handbooks

[Sleepy Voiced]

So, when I first read the announcement for AU, I thought it was the best idea, exactly what I needed. When it came out it was as cool as I had hoped. Now Malhavoc has announced another variant/alternate PHB in Iron Lore. This too looks awesome. AU and IL approach the PHB concept from different angles, creating very different types of games (as far as can be assumed from what we know of IL).
So, my question is, who would you like to see write a variant PHB? What D20 writer or publisher could give you the tools to take your game in a new and interesting direction, while still remaining close enough to D&D to only necessitate a new PHB (the DMG and MM would still be usable)?
To get things started, I think the alternate PHB route would be a great way for Chris Pramas/Green Ronin to tackle Dragon Fist. The tweaks would be primarily in classes and combat to make things more wuxia. I guess I am looking for a "Wuxia-handbook to D&D" in this.
Of course it could be followed with a world book for Tianguo (like Diamond Throne). But overall, it would still be usable with D&D, you can tag elements from your standard PHB in and out (a sect of halfling martial artists in a lost corner of Tianguo, why not!), but would also be all you need to start a game.
So, what do you think? Who else could pull off a really cool variant?

 

[DaveMage]

I'm happy with the D&D PHB.

Don't need any others.

 

[BiggusGeekus]

I dunno. On a superficial level I think most of them.

When you're talking about variant PHBs, you're really just driving at ripping out the core classes and re-jiggering the spell lists. I was impressed with Arcana Unearthed's fusion of Indian and western mythos and for me that's what really drove the thing home. I'm afraid that the lesson learned is ripping out core classes and rejiggering spell lists makes an alternate PHB. It doesn't. You really have to have an idea in mind and that idea can't be compatible with the core d20 rules.

 

[Wombat]

There are two companies that I really trust when it comes to D20 products -- Malhavoc Press and Green Ronin. Both have fantastic track records. Even when I don't like a specific product, it is mainly due to the specific topic they are trying out, rather than the quality of the rules. As such, I trust them to come up with interesting alternate PHBs. As can be seen, they've done well in that department so far.

 

[twofalls]

AEG did a varient PHB called Mercenaries. I thought that they did a good job on it. Its 3.0 only which works for me since thats what I play.

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

My alternate PHB is d20 Modern.

 

[woodelf]

Well, first off, it could be argued that there are several others already out there. I'd say Blue Rose pretty much fits into that vein. Ditto Everquest D20 and Grim Tales. IMHO, all are basically taking the idea of D&D and retooling it with a whole new set of widgets. Yes, both have a new spellcasting mechanism, but that'd still be compatible with "standard" monsters and adventures and so on, at least for the most part. And unlike Conan D20, Black Company D20, Wheel of Time D20, or several others, they don't feel like they're trying to be a ruleset for a specific setting so much as a pseudo-generic ruleset, much like D&D3[.5]E (which isn't all that generic, either).

As for others i'd like to see: anything done by a good RPG designer who generally focuses her energies in other directions. Someone whose usual RPG output is significnatly different from the usual D20 System fare would be interesting to see do a serious job at some d20 System design. What would a "variant" of D&D done with D20 System look like if Robin Laws did it? Or George Vasilakos? Or John Wick? I think the fresh look at D20 System, and likely broken assumptions that ensued, would be really cool to see.

One that's on my project list is a ruleset that's social-centric, rather than combat-centric. In most of the current "versions" of D&D discussed in this thread, the system is built around violent/physical encounters and challenges. The classes are most-carefully balanced for that style of play (i.e., "adventuring" in the D&D sense), and it's in those areas where it's made sure no one is left out. So, it's combat (BAB & hps) that everyone gets better at, regardless of class, and even the poorest BAB progression is much closer to the best than in previous editions. There's less concern for other skills, where it's quite possible to have a high-level character with essentially zero ability in an area covered by a skill. And, of course, in wildly different set-ups, the class balance pretty much goes away: put a group of characters built with D&D3E, Everquest D20, or even Arcana Unearthed into a court-intrigue setting, where violence is never an option, and magic use is strictly controlled and limited, and suddenly several of the classes have nothing to do, others are badly nerfed, and only a few classes have directly-applicable abilities.

So, I'd like to reverse this, and start with the assumption that in the zero-violence, regulated-magic, minimal-physicality setting, all the classes are equal. Not that there would be no combat-capable classes, but that those abilities would be considered secondary (or even tertiary), and balanced appropriately. So everyone would get better at social stuff with increased level, and the feats would be focused around those sorts of challenges/abilities, and skills would take care of combat and physical stuff. I've got some working notes, and even used a variant for a convention game (albeit one in a very unusual setting, fairly low-tech, highly urban and social) which went pretty well. Now i've just gotta finish up the other 3 things ahead of it on the "to do" list.

 

[Remathilis]

With only passing knowledge of AU, I think all "alternate" PH's fall into one of two catagories...

1.) We've made a generic system by filing the name off the monk and the ears off the elf.

2.) We're introducing a whole-new campaign setting and this is our gateway to redefine the class/race system.

Granted, neither is a bad thing. However I'd be leary about them. I really don't need the first (though some alternate versions would be nice, like a good archer, summoner, or shaman base class) and the second would rarely be played. If AU is any indication, any alternate PH would also be incompatible with 90% of the current D&D/D20 anyway, so you kinda get stuck playing in their yard anyway...

All that said, a d20 Version of Final Fantasy XI would rock on toast!

 

[Voadam]

BESM d20
Spycraft
Judge Dredd
Conan
Lone Wolf
Babylon 5
Farspace (sp? the one off the sci fi channel show)
Everquest RPG PH
Star Wars d20
Wheel of Time d20
Call of Cthulhu d20
Mutants and Masterminds
Deeds not Words
Vigilance
Star Gate
Grim Tales
d20 Modern
Slaine
Sovereign Stone Campaign Setting
Elements of Magic Revised
Blue Rose
Black Company
Fading Suns d20
Slayers d20
Talislanta d20
Arcana Unearthed

There are plenty of alternative PHs to explore with d20/OGL material.

 

[woodelf]

BESM d20
Spycraft
Judge Dredd
Conan
Lone Wolf
Babylon 5
Farspace (sp? the one off the sci fi channel show)
Everquest RPG PH
Star Wars d20
Wheel of Time d20
Call of Cthulhu d20
Mutants and Masterminds
Deeds not Words
Vigilance
Star Gate
Grim Tales
d20 Modern
Slaine
Sovereign Stone Campaign Setting
Elements of Magic Revised
Blue Rose
Black Company
Fading Suns d20
Slayers d20
Talislanta d20
Arcana Unearthed

There are plenty of alternative PHs to explore with d20/OGL material.

Yes, but most of those are not meant as a drop-in replacement for the D&D3E PH--they aren't pseudo-generic high fantasy. Well, except maybe Lone Wolf (and the ones I previously mentioned). While Arcana Unearthed/Evolved, Blue Rose, and Everquest D20 all, arguably, produce roughly the same sort of game--it's still, to a large degree "D&D"--using Spycraft, or even Talislanta D20, is definitely *not* the same game any more.