D&D 5E Out of the Abyss Question with MAJOR SPOILER!

[pontinyc]

I just saw a review of the adventure by Draven Swiftbo on Youtube. He alluded to the fact that the endgame, as it were, of the adventure has the pc's each playing a different demon lord in an epic battle against each other. Can anyone confirm or deny this?

If it is true, could anyone who currently owns the adventure offer any thoughts on the feasibility of, instead, having the pc's fight each of the demon lords sequentially? My players are extremely excited about eventually going toe-to-toe with each one and probably getting their hindquarters handed to them. They would, however, not be interested in only fighting Demogorgon after all of the others have been killed either by each other or by him/her/it.

Thanks in advance for any info!

 

[Daern]

The wisest course of action is for the heroes to lie in wait and battle the survivor of the battle royal. They can get involved as early as they want, but they'll get whipped.

 

[pontinyc]

A good strategy, Daern, for sure but I'm still trying to discern whether or not this is how the adventure ends. And, if so, how easy it might be to restructure it so they fight each demon lord separately, all of those fights eventually leading up to Demogorgon. My players are not going to be happy about spending 15 levels looking forward to trying their hand at going toe-to-toe with each of those guys and then, once arriving at that point, discovering that Demogorgon is going to just do all the work for them anyway. To clarify, many players will love this, to be sure. I just would like to do something a little different and am wondering how easy it might be to change the story to involve separate fights.

Anyone have any thoughts regarding this? Thanks!

 

[Daern]

Its really the players' choice. They can attack the demons one by one. They aren't super hard to find. The only problem is that any one of them at full strength will probly shred a 15th level party.

 

[CapnZapp]

Make it obvious two of the demon lords have some kind of understanding going on, if not an outright alliance.

If the players don't attack or at the very least distract one in the pairing, they will curbstomp the others without becoming sufficiently weakened.

Do add clues that hint at this pairing beforehand, though.

 

[MonsterEnvy]

A good strategy, Daern, for sure but I'm still trying to discern whether or not this is how the adventure ends. And, if so, how easy it might be to restructure it so they fight each demon lord separately, all of those fights eventually leading up to Demogorgon. My players are not going to be happy about spending 15 levels looking forward to trying their hand at going toe-to-toe with each of those guys and then, once arriving at that point, discovering that Demogorgon is going to just do all the work for them anyway. To clarify, many players will love this, to be sure. I just would like to do something a little different and am wondering how easy it might be to change the story to involve separate fights.

Anyone have any thoughts regarding this? Thanks!

Actually it more or less works like this. BIG SPOILERS

The PC's at some point after the half way point discover a Drow Archmage named Vizeran DeVir (A worshiper of the Elder Elemental Eye and the creator of the weapons that set off the plot of Princes of the Apocalypse). Vizeran is troubled by the presence of the Demon Lords as well. And wants an alliance with the PC's (Who as the leaders of an expedition force at this point have quite a bit of resources). Vizeran knows a powerful ritual casting it will attract all of the Demon Lords to a single point. As they all hate each other they should fight until only one of them has not been banished back to the abyss. Vizeran also intends for the point all the Demon Lords will be attracted to be Menzoberranzan so that it will be destroyed in the ritual and the coming of the Demon Lords. (Because he hates Lolth and his ex homeland and views this as a good way to kill two birds with one stone.)

However the problem with Vizeran's plan is that he does not have the components needed to casts the ritual. So this is were his alliance with the PC's comes in. He wants them and their expedition force to collect the needed components for the ritual.

Pretty much the PC's will know well in advance about the big fight with the Demon Lords as a good focus for part of the campaign is making it so they will fight each other So the PC's can banish the weakened winner. The PC's can run into the Demon Lords at different points as well anyway. Doing it one by one will result in the PC's being squashed like bugs. Even if they got lucky enough to beat one the 2nd one would crush them. I would go with what the module suggests. Allow each character to take control of one of the Demon Lords and fight in a battle royal between them. Six Demon Lords should take part in the fight any remaining can be controlled by the DM.

 

[delericho]

If it is true, could anyone who currently owns the adventure offer any thoughts on the feasibility of, instead, having the pc's fight each of the demon lords sequentially? My players are extremely excited about eventually going toe-to-toe with each one and probably getting their hindquarters handed to them.

Your best bet in that case is probably to extend the campaign by several levels - fifteenth level PCs probably won't have much chance, but by 20th they might. Oh, and you'll probably want to change the ritual so that it calls the nearest demon lord, rather than all of them at once.

 

[Mercule]

Mixed feelings about this. It's the first bit of news that really reduces my interest in the module by a significant amount. It might work, but... meh.

 

[jrowland]

My 2cp,

Extend the campaign to level 20.

Do the Module as written, but modify the battle royale such that some or all of the Demon Lords can escape the ritual (The Drow will certainly do something, Archmage Gromph and Matron Mother Quenthel at the very least, perhaps even Lolth herself. If players squawk tell them to trust you, this is just an excuse to get behind the wheel of the Demon Lords and give them some meta-game knowledge of what they are up against.

Next, have the PCs, perhaps even aided by the Drow (Matron Mother Quenthel!) go gather artifact(s) to help them defeat the Demon Princes (and once they are banished, the drow ambush them for the artifacts of course!). This part should be 15-20 with an artifact per PC if you can swing it/stomach it. Then at level 20 (or 21 with a nice meaty boon per the DMG) go after the Demon Lords.

Obviously, some of them can be taken on earlier, and likely should. And if the player thing a Demon Lord is kind of "meh" it can be banished in the Battle Royale.

YMMV

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

I'm going to be doing it with 7-8 PC playing so I wonder how that many 15th level PC will do against one of the demon lords. That many PC throws CR way out of wack.