Overplanning?

[pjrake]

I'm more of an improvised DM, but lately I've been listening to podcasts and reading articles on how to improve as a DM, and many mention that as a DM, you should plan out your sessions well, even if you improvise.

So here is a sample encounter regarding Skill Challenge. As I'm planning this, I'm getting a bit overwhelmed. Maybe I'm just over planning, and might feel there won't be a flow during actual game. Anyway, below is the notes for the upcoming encounter. Let me know what are your thoughts. Thanks!







Skill Challenge: The Magic Mouth (Encounter Level 7, 600 XP)


Magical runes are burned on the wooden door, forming the shape of a large mouth, and the door handle has been removed.

Magic Mouth:
* Door has magic lock (DC 33)
* Magic mouth on door; speaks common (w/ dwarven accent)

Petris Giantcrippler:
* Male dwarven soul
* Cannot see; ask for numbers in party
* Too many intruders lately
* Upset if hears voice of an orc

Q. What Are You Doing Here?
He says, “I’m one of the original miners of this fine establishment… until a boulder bashed my skull, and my soul has been trapped here ever since.”

Q. Where Is The Beholder?
He says, “He’s locked up in his lair below, dealing with a group of robed men. Apparently, a group of adventurers were here and killed off a power wizard that was part of a secret cult or something. He’s also pissed off ‘cause they stole some flaming shield or something. That wouldn’t be you guys, eh?”

Q. Who Are These Robed Men?
He says, “Some group that has been running the town outside. It appears all the important folks are part of this cult, including the governor, or mayor, or priest or something.”

Q. How Can We Get Past the Door?
He says, “You need the magic key. You appear harmless enough, so I’ll give it to you. Here…” spits out from mouth.

Skill Challenge Specifics:
* Need six success (before three failures)
* Moderate (DC 16); Hard (DC 23)
* Seven skills (first five are primary):
1. Dungeoneering (dwarf built the dungeon)
2. Arcana (magic key)
3. History (dungeon was built as a shrine)
4. Religion (shrine of Kord, page 50 RC)
5. Diplomacy (convince they are good party)
6. Nature
7. Perception

 

[mneme]

I'm not sure why you're making this a skill challenge at all, actually. It sounds like you've got an NPC (a magic door) with some basic dialogue choices. RP scenes are perfectly fine; sketch out the character's motivations, likes/dislikes, knowedge, and resources (and mabye some DCs for things they may or may not reveal, or a few scripted answers as you have above) and call it a day.

But as far as skill challenges go, the best approach is to start with the story and only pull the mechanics in after:

1. What are the characters trying to accomplish?
2. What stands in their way (and how can they overcome these)? -- from here you get the key skills.
3. After they've dealt with the first set, what -else- stands in their way? --most skill challenges shouldn't be "flat", with all options and challenges immediately apparent; instead they should be divided into "rooms" where the first set of successes unlock other ways to proceed and so on, thus giving the challenge a comprehensible story; repeat 3 and 2 as necessary.
4. Why is there a chance of failure, and what does it entail? (from here, you get the storyline behind the failure conditions, how likely they should be (how much success you need), and a guideline if you need to use a non-standard failure condition (the golem challenge in Dragon, or an "x rounds" race) or if it makes sense to make some skills erase a failure on success.

 

[pjrake]

Skill Challenges are probably the hardest set of new rules to understand! You are right, normally I would just roleplay the encounter, throw in a couple of DC checks as the encounter is unfolding, and call it a day.

But after reading the chapter on skill challenges (pg 224 of the new DM book), it talks about using challenges for "disabling a complex trap." Since I already had in mind the Magic Mouth encounter, I figured why not try these new rules here.

However, the more I look at my notes, the more I just wanna get rid of the whole challenge and leave the basics there.

-PJ

 

[Holy Bovine]

I have to agree with nmeme - this does not seem like a good idea for the skill challenge system. It is essentially a role pay encounter that it seems like you want the PCs to succeed at. Indeed it looks like it might be vital for them to succeed in which case you have ask - what price has failure? If they fail the challenge are they then prevented from advancing further in the adventure?

 

[pjrake]

I think the whole "success" and "failure" is probably throwing me off. Again, according to the rules, there really is no failure, just harder for the PCs if they get 3 failures. So in my encounter, they will still go through the door, but if they got 3 failures, maybe they don't get a key piece of information when it comes time to face the big villain.

-PJ

 

[Katana_Geldar]

Then you impov another way for them to get the information. Simple.

 

[Brys]

The encounter looks good, the question is: what do they get if they succeed, and what do they get/suffer if they fail. As long as there is a consequence of failing, a skill challenge is a fine mechanism.

So, if they succeed, they get the key to go through and door remembers something to help them in the fight against the BBEG. Maybe tell them which defense is his lowest - I noticed he had a quite a limp...he could still move quickly once he got going but I'm sure it's slowing down his reactions. Maybe tell them a vulnerability or resistance - when he grabbed the torch from the sconce he picked it up by the flaming end.

If they fail, they get the key and don't get an advantage in the combat. Or maybe the door leads them wrong - the old man looked tough I bet if you take out his pet Owlbear he'll probably just surrender.

The last part is to keep secret as best you can whether they succeed or fail.

 

[WalterKovacs]

If you do end up making a success/failure option, it could be something as simple as, either way he let's them in, but if the party fails, he sends some sort of message to the Beholder or one of his underlings. Basically, as a result of the failure either one of the encounters they would be facing is harder (because they are given a chance to prepare, reinforce, arange an ambush, etc) or perhaps an extra encounter is introduced as an extra wave of baddies are brought in from elsewhere to deal with the threat they know about, etc. [It can even work out that the XP they failed to get from the skill challenge is alloted to the encounter they 'cause' ...]

They may also lose out on rewards, or at least make it harder for the party to get it, as the "alert" from the door gives them time to put the offerings the robed men had brought into the treasury, instead of it being still out in the open when the party arrived.

[Also, if the robed figures are tipped off, they may have a chance to escape before the party arrives, preventing them from catching the cultists in the act, requiring them to track them down later and find a way to prove who they are].

 

[pjrake]

I really like those suggestions!

I'm still a bit torn as to actually run a skill challenge encounter, or just a simple "roleplay" scene.

In my notes I have two separate scenarios, and will probably decide right before the encounter happens. But I will add those "success/fail" options you guys suggested! Thanks!

-PJ

 

[pjrake]

This is what I wrote down in my notes regarding success or failure:

Skill Challenge:
• Need six successes (before three failures)
• Moderate (DC 16); Hard (DC 23)
• Dungeoneering (dwarf built dungeon)
• Arcana (magic key)
• History (dungeon was built as a shrine)
• Religion (shrine of Kord, page 50 of RC)
• Diplomacy (convince party is good in nature)
• Success: Key given, dwarf tells party Beholder’s weakness is Fortitude
• Failure: Key given, dwarf alerts Beholder of heroes coming

-PJ