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Pathfinder 1E Paizo no longer publishing Dungeon and Dragon
- Thread starter Exquisite Dead Guy
- Start date
AdmundfortGeographer
Getting lost in fantasy maps
I imagine it is because folks who really use the WotC boards are intimately familiar with the history of rotten execution on WotC's online site. A magazine is always delivered monthly, barring rare postal errors for a few, and when you have it in hand it doesn't just disappear. But WotC's website goes down frequently taking it away from everyone for that duration.Emirikol said:
Plus WotC has a history of starting an online feature only to discontinue it with little explanation. WotC site users are familiar with this more than most.
Silver Moon
Adventurer
I am saddened by this move - I will miss my monthly Dungeon magazine.
3catcircus
Adventurer
Lots of people have been saying it is like a punch in the gut. No it isn't. It is worse. It is like a kick in the balls...
I can't say that I've liked everything (or even many things) in Dungeon or Dragon, but I started subscribing again last year after a 10+ year hiatus because they were much better than in previous years. I specifically bought Dragon for those rare gems (things like the article on The Hordelands, Issues 315 and 318, etc.) I specifically bought Dungeon for the sheer variety in each issue.
While the idea of Pathfinder is cool, it just isn't for me. I want *variety* in each issue, not an adventure path as the only option.
WotC's reading of their customers is the same as the democrats' reading of the American public's reason for voting in the last election - that is - a complete misreading. How many of the foot soldiers at WotC threw up their hands and said "IDIOTS!" when they heard about this?
If (and this is a BIG if) WotC's concept for online Dungeon and Dragon content is as follows, then I'd consider it:
1. Fully-tagged PDFs and fully-linked HTML files that can be downloaded to my hard drive for local storage - I'm not gonna pay you to provide content that can be withdrawn or withheld at your whim, let alone the whim of the power or telecomm grids' stability.
2. Maps that are able to be printed out in 1" = 5' scale. This is the one problem with the "new" encounter format and is already evident. The battlemaps in the adventures are worthless and they won't post scaled maps online.
3. No mandatory advertisements. Your publishing costs just got cut (at least by half) since you have no printing costs - no paper, no inks, etc. I'm not paying to see online advertisements (and I use adblockers anyway).
4. New content every month. I'm not gonna pay for sporadic updates to a website.
5. No java-based, web-only tools. I'm not storing a character on your server. I'm not using your dice-roller. I'm not using any of your content "online" at my gaming table.
Somehow, I don't think that any of the above are going to be part of WotC's intent.
My plans:
1. I'll still buy WotC print products (if they don't suck).
2. I've no intention of paying for an online tool or content unless it is DRM/restriction-free and I can save it to my hard drive, print out relevant parts, etc.
3. For my Forgotten Realms fix, I'll go to Candlekeep.
4. Hopefully, WotC will just bleed and bleed until they have to sell the D&D brand or risk it becoming worth less than what they paid for it.
5. Whoever buys D&D turns paizo back on to do Dragon and Dungeon.
6. Whoever buys D&D will put out print products with a link to a secure website to download a free watermarked PDF of the book the customer just bought.
I certainly don't want to see paizo die, but I'm not sure that they won't also get caught in the backlash of hate. How many of the contributors to Dungeon and Dragon will refuse to supply content to WotC? Hopefully, all of them (yeah, yeah, I know starving writers still gotta make a living...)
I can't say that I've liked everything (or even many things) in Dungeon or Dragon, but I started subscribing again last year after a 10+ year hiatus because they were much better than in previous years. I specifically bought Dragon for those rare gems (things like the article on The Hordelands, Issues 315 and 318, etc.) I specifically bought Dungeon for the sheer variety in each issue.
While the idea of Pathfinder is cool, it just isn't for me. I want *variety* in each issue, not an adventure path as the only option.
WotC's reading of their customers is the same as the democrats' reading of the American public's reason for voting in the last election - that is - a complete misreading. How many of the foot soldiers at WotC threw up their hands and said "IDIOTS!" when they heard about this?
If (and this is a BIG if) WotC's concept for online Dungeon and Dragon content is as follows, then I'd consider it:
1. Fully-tagged PDFs and fully-linked HTML files that can be downloaded to my hard drive for local storage - I'm not gonna pay you to provide content that can be withdrawn or withheld at your whim, let alone the whim of the power or telecomm grids' stability.
2. Maps that are able to be printed out in 1" = 5' scale. This is the one problem with the "new" encounter format and is already evident. The battlemaps in the adventures are worthless and they won't post scaled maps online.
3. No mandatory advertisements. Your publishing costs just got cut (at least by half) since you have no printing costs - no paper, no inks, etc. I'm not paying to see online advertisements (and I use adblockers anyway).
4. New content every month. I'm not gonna pay for sporadic updates to a website.
5. No java-based, web-only tools. I'm not storing a character on your server. I'm not using your dice-roller. I'm not using any of your content "online" at my gaming table.
Somehow, I don't think that any of the above are going to be part of WotC's intent.
My plans:
1. I'll still buy WotC print products (if they don't suck).
2. I've no intention of paying for an online tool or content unless it is DRM/restriction-free and I can save it to my hard drive, print out relevant parts, etc.
3. For my Forgotten Realms fix, I'll go to Candlekeep.
4. Hopefully, WotC will just bleed and bleed until they have to sell the D&D brand or risk it becoming worth less than what they paid for it.
5. Whoever buys D&D turns paizo back on to do Dragon and Dungeon.
6. Whoever buys D&D will put out print products with a link to a secure website to download a free watermarked PDF of the book the customer just bought.
I certainly don't want to see paizo die, but I'm not sure that they won't also get caught in the backlash of hate. How many of the contributors to Dungeon and Dragon will refuse to supply content to WotC? Hopefully, all of them (yeah, yeah, I know starving writers still gotta make a living...)
My first Dragon was issue 43. I've had a subscription for years. Some of my favorite game content (such as the demihuman pantheons, by Roger Moore), was Dragon magazine content.
It does feel weird, but it's not like I haven't already seen enormous changes to the game, since those days when the Illusionist was a class only available in the Dragon...
It does feel weird, but it's not like I haven't already seen enormous changes to the game, since those days when the Illusionist was a class only available in the Dragon...
MrFilthyIke
First Post
A note to Hellhound, diaglo, Shem, and others toasting tonight.
I have toasted the Great Old Magazines with the wife. In choosing what
to toast a pair of D&D magazines with, only one thing shot straight to my mind.
Mothy Python's Holy Grail Ale. Nothing is more appropriate in my mind.
Cheers! *wanders off to continue drinking*
I have toasted the Great Old Magazines with the wife. In choosing what
to toast a pair of D&D magazines with, only one thing shot straight to my mind.
Mothy Python's Holy Grail Ale. Nothing is more appropriate in my mind.
Cheers! *wanders off to continue drinking*
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