Paragon Path: Champion of the Colossus Blade

[riplox]

Well, after being over at the WotC boards since '04, I've pretty much given up on them, at least until they can get their boards stable. I've heard good things about this site and thought I should join. So to inaugurate my first post, I'll submit a Fighter Paragon Path that was adapted from an old 3.5 PrC I made a while back which got some pretty good praise. I present to you, The Champion of the Colossus Blade or Colossus Blade for short.

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UPDATE Aug 1, 2008: Added a new class for the Flail, Hammer, and Mace user - Champion of the Titan's Maul.
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[smallcaps]Champion of the Colossus Blade[/smallcaps]
"My weapon can strike down any foe, no matter how great!"

Prerequisite: Fighter or Paladin class

You are massive in size and might and wield a weapon great enough to demonstrate these attributes. No foe can ignore your power and few can withstand your assault.

[smallcaps]Colossus Blade Path Features[/smallcaps]
Iron Grip (11th Level): You can use Axes and Heavy Blades that do not have reach, and are one size larger than you if they are two-handed or two-sizes larger if they are one-handed, as if they were your size.
Special: If you already have the Oversized trait prior to adopting this Paragon path, you gain a
+2 bonus to damage rolls with Axes and Heavy Blades weapons.

Slow and Steady (11th Level): You can spend an action point to gain a +2 bonus to attack rolls, and bonus to any damage you deal equal to your Strength modifier plus your Constitution modifier if you are wielding an Axe, or your Dexterity modifier if you are wielding a Heavy Blade, until the end of your next turn, instead of taking an extra action.


Take Cover (16th Level): Whenever you use the Total Defense action, you grant yourself cover as long as you are wielding a weapon a size category greater than you.

[smallcaps]Colossus Blade Exploits[/smallcaps]
Scything Assault
Colossus Blade Attack 11
You swing your enormous weapon in a wide arc letting it's great weight carve through
adjacent enemies.

Encounter ♦ Martial, Weapon
Standard Action
Close Burst 1
Target: Each enemy in the burst you can see.
Attack: Strength vs. AC
Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifier damage and the target is dazed until the end of your next turn.
Miss: Half Damage and the target is not dazed.


Backlash Parry
Colossus Blade Utility 12
With unparalleled speed and skill you deflect an incoming attack.

Daily ♦ Martial, Weapon
Immediate Interrupt
Personal
Trigger: An enemy targets you with a melee or ranged attack.
Effect: You gain a bonus to your defense score that the enemies' attack targeted equal to your Constitution modifier if you are wielding an Axe, or your Dexterity modifier if you are wielding a Heavy Blade, versus this attack. If the attack misses because of this bonus, the attack is reflected back at the enemy using their same attack roll versus their defense score the attack targeted.
Special: If the attack hits you, regardless of your new defense score, you may use this ability again.


Force of Spirit
Colossus Blade Attack 20
Through sheer force of will, you empower your weapon to deal a massive amount of damage and slam your opponent into the ground with this attack.

Daily ♦ Martial, Reliable, Weapon
Standard Action
Melee Weapon
Target: One Creature
Attack: Strength +2 vs. AC and you must spend two healing surges without regaining any hit points
Hit: 3[W] + Strength modifier + your healing surge value damage and the target is knocked prone. In addition, the target is dazed until the end of your next turn.
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[smallcaps]Champion of the Titan's Maul[/smallcaps]
"Once, the Titans only knew such power. Now it belongs to me!"

Prerequisite: Fighter or Paladin class

You are barbarous in combat and your massive weapon only accentuates that fact. Your brutal blows leave enemies battered and broken and even the earth itself quakes under the weight of your weapon.

[smallcaps]Titan's Maul Path Features[/smallcaps]
Titan's Hands (11th Level): You can use Flails, Hammers, and Maces that do not have reach, and are one size larger than you if they are two-handed or two-sizes larger if they are one-handed, as if they were your size.
Special: If you already have the Oversized trait prior to adopting this Paragon path, you gain a +2 bonus to damage rolls with Flails, Hammers, and Maces.

Dwarven Battle Stance (12th level): Once per encounter; for a number of rounds equal to your Constitution modifier; you gain +1 to your Fortitude defense and decrease the amount that effects force you to be pushed, pulled, or slid by 1 square.

Knock Them Senseless (16th Level): When you spend an action point to take an extra action, until the end of your next turn, all your attacks daze your targets until the end of their next turn.


[smallcaps]Titan's Maul Exploits[/smallcaps]
Staggering Blow
Titan's Maul Attack 11
You land a mighty blow that sends your opponent reeling and weakened for a short time.

Encounter ♦ Martial, Reliable, Weapon
Standard Action
Melee weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Strength vs Fortitude
Hit: 3[W] + Strength + Constitution modifier damage and the target is pushed a number of squares equal to your Strength modifier and is weakened until the end of your next turn.


To the Limit
Titan's Maul Utility 12
You push yourself to your limit to overcome your foes.

Daily ♦ Martial
Minor Action
Personal
Effect: You gain an action point that you must spend during your current turn.


Earthbreaker
Titan's Maul Attack 20
The ground around you shatters into rubble, as you smash the earth in front of you with an ear-shattering crack, and your enemies topple over like toy soldiers.

Daily ♦ Martial, Weapon, Thunder
Standard Action
Close Burst 2
Target: Each creature in a burst in contact with the ground.
Attack: Strength vs. Reflex
Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifier thunder damage, and the target is knocked prone until the end of your next turn. In addition, all ground within the burst becomes difficult terrain.
Special: Allies within the burst gain a bonus to thier Reflex defense, equal to your Strength modifier, versus this attack.

 

[TheLordWinter]

Shouldn't the Daily power be gained at level 20?

 

[DanChops]

Just looking at the class features (I'll take a closer look at the powers in a minute) I had two thoughts. First, is there a "Total Defense Action" in 4E? I can't recall. Second, neither of the 11th-level features are triggered by using an action point, which seems to be a universal aspect of one of every paragon path's 11th-level features.

With that in mind, perhaps it would work to re-word cover so that it somehow triggers off using an action point. It seems that soley granting cover on use of an action point isn't quite at the same level of potency as the other fighter paragon paths, so perhaps a bump to AC and Ref would be warranted as well? Maybe "when you use an action point to take an extra action, you also gain cover and bonus to your AC and Ref defenses equal to your associated weapon group's ability modifier until the end of your next turn."

 

[DanChops]

Looking at the powers:

Scything Assault seems too powerful. Close burst 1 for 3[W] damage simply out-classes all the other fighger pp level 11 powers. I'd think that reducing it to 1[W] and adding a status effect (maybe stunned? slowed?) would be a good thematic fit.

I just realized that Backlash Parry does in part what I suggested Take Cover could do. Hrm, I'll need to think of a different suggestion for take cover. Regardless, I like this power - it seems to be in line with the other two daily level 22 paragon utilities, and it fits well thematically.

Force of Spirit should indeed be level 20. I love the concept - spend a healing surge to put the hurt on the bad guy. Brilliant. However, it seems a bit underpowered to me. The other four level 20 dailies in comparison are all either 4[w] v. one target + effect, or 2[w] v. mulitiple targets + effect. Now, I realize that the healing surge value for a 20th level fighter is going to be on the order of 37 hit points or so, which is probably worth about 2[w] damage in and of itself, but you have to loose a healing surge to gain that additional damage. At the very least, I would think an interesting effect should be added, and I don't know that 3[w] damage would be too much.

 

[Stalker0]

Now, I realize that the healing surge value for a 20th level fighter is going to be on the order of 37 hit points or so, which is probably worth about 2[w] damage in and of itself, but you have to loose a healing surge to gain that additional damage. At the very least, I would think an interesting effect should be added, and I don't know that 3[w] damage would be too much.

Well, if he's using an oversized weapon he's probably doing about 2d8 normally, so 2[w] is an average of 18. This is doing nearly twice that much, so I think its worthwhile.

I agree that scything assault is way too strong. Also, I think slow and steady can be monstrously strong at higher levels. Why use encounter powers when my at-will does x2 strength + dex or con damage, gets a +2 to attack, and has a better chance to crit. But at the same time I don't know if I can judge 16th level paragon path abilities too well yet. Just remember, your paragon path is doing more damage than other fighters simply because of his oversized weapon. He doesn't need a lot of extra damage.

Overall, I love the flavor (and the picture is awesome). Also, the idea of taking cover behind your blade is cool, especially in that FFVII cloud sword kind of way.

However, to me, part of the weilding the big sword is the fact that you knock opponents back with your swings, or knock them senseless. I'm not getting the feel of that here. Here are my suggestions:

Iron Grip: Leave as is.
Take Cover: Whenever spending an action point and wielding an oversized weapon, you gain the benefits of cover.
Slow and Steady -> Colossus Strike: When using a basic melee attack or melee power, you can choose to use both your move and standard actions for the attack. When doing so, a successful hit causes a push 1 on the target. If the attack already has a push effect, increase that effect by 1 square.

Scything Assault
Colossus Blade Attack 11
You swing your enormous weapon in a wide arc letting it's great weight carve through
adjacent enemies.

Encounter ♦ Martial, Weapon
Standard Action
Close Burst 1
Target: Each enemy in a burst you can see
Attack: Strength vs. AC
Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifier damage.


Backlash Parry -> Bonecrushing Stance:

Utility 12
You ignore strong hide and steel armor, releasing a crushing blow that breaks your opponent's bones.
stance * daily
While in this stance, any attack vs AC becomes attack vs fort.
**This might actually be overpowered as well, it gives a pretty strong bonus to attacks in many cases. I'll let others give their opinions.

Force of Spirit
I would put in the reliable keyword, but you can mention that the person still uses a healing surge on a miss if you want to.

 

[riplox]

Total Defense is there. It gives +2 to all Defenses and costs your standard action to use.

Oops. I missleveled Force of Spirit which also was originally 4[w]+str+healing surge.

Um, also Scything assault is actually about right. I know it's an encounter power, but other than that, it pretty much does the same as Thicket of Blades (though that's a level 9 daily and slows).

And about the action point ability...do we HAVE to follow previous examples?
I really don't like action point abilities even though they have some nice stuff sometimes, and my original 3.5 version of this class had nothing like that really.
Also, I was hoping to keep this class as close in function and power as possible (scaled for 4.0 of course), so that means no changing of abilities to something almost or completely different.
If y'all can come up with an action point power that does the same thing as one of the abilities in my old class and keep it 4.0 balanced, that's cool.

 

[DanChops]

Oops. I missleveled Force of Spirit which also was originally 4[w]+str+healing surge.

Hrm, I know that this PP's schtick is going to be doing massive damage with his massive blades, but that may be a bit much. Consider that an oversized Maul does 2d8 damage (9 average), and that you can expect a 20th level Fighter to have a 23 Strength (+6), 37 point healing surge, and a +4 weapon. That works out to an average of 83 damage on a hit.

In contrast, consider a Pit Fighter using a Maul doing the Lion of Battle exploit (currently the highest single-target potential damage of any of the fighter paragon path 20th-level exploits.) The Maul does 2d6 damage (8 average); assume the same strength and magic weapon. That works out to 42 damage on a hit, or 58 if the target is bloodied.

Now, granted, Lion of Battle also has a very nice controller-y effect, and Force of Spirit actually costs a non-trivial resource to use. However, Is that worth a 25 (or even 41) damage difference? I honestly don't know, but I think it's worth play testing to find out. My inclination, though, is still to lower the damage to 3[W] and add an interesting effect.

Um, also Scything assault is actually about right. I know it's an encounter power, but other than that, it pretty much does the same as Thicket of Blades (though that's a level 9 daily and slows).

See, I wasn't comparing it to other Fighter exploits, I was comparing it to the four other level 11 Fighter Paragon Path encounter exploits. A bit narrow of a comparison to be sure, but I think the best way to eyeball the balanced nature of a home brewed power is to compare it to existing powers that occupy the same design space. Of course, if you have a chance to play test it and find that it works for your table as written, more power to you. I was just saying that I would probably alter it a bit for my table.

Total Defense is there. It gives +2 to all Defenses and costs your standard action to use.

Good to know. Thanks!

And about the action point ability...do we HAVE to follow previous examples?
I really don't like action point abilities even though they have some nice stuff sometimes, and my original 3.5 version of this class had nothing like that really.
Also, I was hoping to keep this class as close in function and power as possible (scaled for 4.0 of course), so that means no changing of abilities to something almost or completely different.
If y'all can come up with an action point power that does the same thing as one of the abilities in my old class and keep it 4.0 balanced, that's cool.

Well, we certainly don't have to follow previous examples. Indeed, at the risk of sounding facetious, you are of course more than welcome to do whatever you'd like at your table. However, as I mentioned before, the easiest way to evaluated the relative power level of a new ability is to compare it to what has come before. In the case of paragon paths, that means that one of the 11th-level features keys of the use of an action point. I've got to run to work right now, but I'll check out the 3.5 version later on and see if I can come up with a suggestion for that feature that ties closer to the inspiration of the path.

 

[riplox]

Well, I moved stuff around and changed a few things. Slow and Steady is now an 11th level action point ability, and Take cover has been moved to 16th level. Also, I have reduced the damage done by Scything Assault and Force of Spirit by 1[W].

 

[DanChops]

Looking through your original 3.5 version of the class, a few things stood out: Knock Them Senseless has a nice daze effect and Crescent Strike has a nice push effect.

With that in mind, let me take another look at your features and powers:

Iron Grip (11th Level): You can use Axes and Heavy Blades thatare not polearms and are one size larger than you as if they were your size.

Special: If you already have the Oversized trait prior to adopting this Paragon path, you gain a +2 bonus to damage rolls with Axes and Heavy Blades weapons.

I don’t see any need to change this at all. Necessary for the flavor of the Path.

Slow and Steady (11th Level): You can spend an action point to gain a +2 bonus to attack rolls, and bonus to any damage you deal equal to your Strength modifier plus your associated weapon group's ability modifier, until the beginning of your next turn, instead of taking an extra action.

I like this. A bit more potent that some of the other action point class features, but you don’t actually get an extra action. Seems like a good trade-off.

Take Cover (16th Level): Whenever you use the Total Defense action, you grant yourself cover as long as you are wielding a weapon a size category greater than you.

This seems to work well, and like Stalker I love the image of a dude taking cover behind his honking-huge sword.

Scything Assault

Colossus Blade Attack 11
You swing your enormous weapon in a wide arc letting it's great weight carve through
adjacent enemies.

Encounter ♦ Martial, Weapon
Standard Action
Close Burst 1
Target: Each enemy in a burst you can see
Attack: Strength vs. AC
Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifier damage.
Miss: Half Damage.

I’m still not sure about this one. Compared to the Level 11 Encounter exploits in the other fighter Paragon Paths, it just seems a bit too much. Mostly that’s due to the range of “close burst”; all the other powers we have to compare it to have range “melee weapon” with “one creature” targets.

Let’s consider our typical fighter from before, Mr. Colossal Blade, with an oversized Maul (9 average damage per [W]), 23 Strength (+6), and a +4 enhancement on his weapon. If my math is right, he would do an average of 28 damage on a hit, and 14 damage on a miss on up to 9 enemies (although realistically he’d probably only ever be attacking 3 or 4 enemies at a time with this exploit) and he would mark all of them, whether he hit or missed. That part about marking is pretty significant in my book.

In comparison, let’s consider Mr. Kensei with a Maul (8 average damage) and the same strength and enhancement bonus on his weapon. Now, since he’s a Kensei he gets a +1 to attack with his Masterstroke exploit, and the exploit itself grants an addition +2 to attack, so that’s something to keep in mind. Mr. Kensei however, will only be doing an average of 26 damage to one enemy, with nothing on a miss.

How about Mr. Iron Vanguard? He will also be averaging 26 damage to one enemy, and he doesn’t have any bonus to attack. However, he gets a nifty pushing and shifting effect that lets him move into the space occupied by his opponent and take his friends along for the ride.

Then there’s Mr. Pit Fighter. He’ll average 26 damage to one enemy, with the possibility of hitting him a second time (with a +2 attack) for an average of 9.5 damage and making the target dazed.

Finally, Mr. Swordmaster. He’ll be hitting more frequently than any of the others, since he’s targeting Ref rather than AC, and he’ll be doing 3[W] damage. Of course, he can’t use a Maul, so let’s have him carrying a Bastard Sword (1d10, average 5.5), and using it two-handed (+1 damage). That means he’ll be doing an average of 27.5 damage to one target. (If he uses a Great Sword, then it becomes 29.5 damage).

So, the only way to do more damage than Scything Assault would produce on average with a Level 11 Fighter Paragon Path encounter exploit is to be a Swordmaster with a Great Sword, and that’s only against one target. Granted, both the Swordmaster and the Kensei will be hitting more frequently, and the Pit Fighter and Iron Vanguard are both doing interesting effects in addition to their damage, but they’re all only attacking one enemy.

So, here’s my proposed alternative:

Scything Assault
Colossus Blade Attack 11
You swing your enormous weapon in a wide arc letting it's great weight carve through
adjacent enemies.

Encounter ♦ Martial, Weapon
Standard Action
Close Burst 1
Target: Each enemy in a burst you can see
Attack: Strength vs. AC
Hit: 1[W] + Strength modifier damage.
Miss: Half Damage.
Effect: Target is dazed until the end of your next turn

This provides an average of 19 damage on a hit, against typically 3 or 4 enemies. If you hit, they will be dazed. And, regardless of if you hit they will all be marked.

Force of Spirit

Colossus Blade Attack 20
Through sheer force of will, you empower your weapon to deal a massive amount of damage
with your next attack.

Daily ♦ Martial, Reliable, Weapon
Standard Action
Melee Weapon
Target: One Creature
Attack: Strength +2 vs. AC and you must spend two healing surges without regaining any hit points
Hit: 3[W] + Strength modifier damage and gain a bonus to the damage roll equal to your healing
surge value.

Looks great to me, although I don’t think that a Push 1 effect would be out of place here.

All in all, I think it looks great. If I had a group to play with, I'd definitly want to try this one out.

 

[DanChops]

Okay, I can't figure out why I got those three "double quote box" dealies up there (when I quoted Iron Grip, Scything Assault, and Force of Spirit.) I've tried to get rid of them, but can't figure out how. Everytime I go in to delete the extra quote tags, they pop back up when I submit the post. Help?