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Pathfinder Beginner Box Review

Hello buckaroos! We return once again from the feet of the golem with a new PAIZO PRODUCT REVIEW! Today we’re looking at the new Pathfinder Beginner Box, Paizo’s latest in a hugely successful line of products for newcomers to our hobby. Spoiler alert: they’ve got another success on their hands. Let’s get into it!

Hello buckaroos! We return once again from the feet of the golem with a new PAIZO PRODUCT REVIEW! Today we’re looking at the new Pathfinder Beginner Box, Paizo’s latest in a hugely successful line of products for newcomers to our hobby. Spoiler alert: they’ve got another success on their hands. Let’s get into it!

PZO2106 PF2 Beginner Box 1200x675.jpg

First Impressions​

We start off this box review with an initial impression, and the initial impression is good! Bright, colorful, cheerful lettering, and a good heft—all things that say “good RPG thing must buy” to my primal dicegoblin brain. Upon first opening, we see a bag of dice, a bag of token bases, and a handful of small inserts culminating in a page that says READ THIS FIRST.

Of course I do not READ THAT FIRST! I huck the token bases to the side and take a gander at the dice. One each of d4, d6, d8, d10, d12, and d20, each in strong, single colors with clear lettering. I’m of mixed mind on these dice. On one hand, I appreciate a grab-bag approach to starter dice: my first starter set in a beginner box had mixed colors, and non-uniform dice to me makes them easier to share. That said, the bright primary colors evoke a handful of crayons, and while beginner boxes are in part meant to accommodate a younger audience and get them excited, I think the color-scheme may be skewing a bit young. The Crayola colors are easily forgiven as soon as you dig past the READ THIS FIRST page and you see the character sheets with delightful reference images for each of the dice—but we’ll get to the character sheets in a bit. I only have a few minor issues left with the dice. This is a bit snobbish, but I consider any dice set that doesn’t have two d10 and four d6 to be incomplete. Also, I’d prefer a resealable dice bag over the disposable one: my first set of dice from my beginner box is down to just five dice from the original ten because they spent their lives rattling around loose in their box.

Now, the inserts! A little postcard lets you know that there’s a custom Syrinscape playlist for the adventure contained within. Neat! The other postcards are player reference cards, which are about the best attempt at getting new players over the fairly steep Pathfinder learning curve I’ve seen yet. That said, there is a bit of a shock when you turn them over and are greeted with a wall of text. Finally, the READ THIS FIRST page is short, sweet, and to the point, laying out how to approach the Box as a solo player or with a group of players.

Character Sheets​

Below the READ THIS FIRST we have the character sheets, and here’s where the Box starts to show its hand a bit. You’re clearly meant to use this with a group of players, as it’s those pregenerated character folios which appear before the Hero’s Handbook which contains the solo adventure. That said, I have quite a lot of good things to say about these character sheets. Cover page features a name, a class, a huge splash art of the character’s portrait, and a quick description to help potential newcomers choose their playstyle.

Like the reference cards, the meat and potatoes of the character sheets can seem like an overwhelming barrage of information, but thankfully a solid half of that text is dedicated to explaining and leading a new player through the rather complicated process of understanding a Pathfinder character sheet. Truly excellent layout design is on display here—little coordinating lettered yellow circles lead the reader easily from explanation to relevant box, and the most-used sections of the sheet (AC, hit points, so on) are boxed out in red to stand out from the regular black. As I said before, there’s a handsome little sidebar displaying each of the dice available and their abbreviations—excellent! Also, I don’t know if I’ve ever seen this on a Pathfinder character sheet before, but these now have a space for personal pronouns! Finally, the layout artist gets a cheeky point from me for putting a few characters of character history on the back page of the folio—literal backstory.

As an aside: Wayne Reynolds' art maintains his high level of technical excellence, but there’s something repetitive about the characters' poses. This all stands in contrast to the cover art for the Hero’s Handbook, done by Ekaterina Burmak. The character posing here helps focus the eye on defining aspects of each character: Kyra’s pose pulls back and up into her holy symbol, shining forth with protecting energy against the lightning blast of the dragon. Valeros pushes forward into his shield, taking the brunt of the blast, emphasizing his role on the front line and the use of his shield in his playstyle. And then, off to the side, we see Merisiel darting in, lines almost blurred with speed, unseen by the dragon, dagger darting forward to the exposed neck. Sure, Wayne’s art is technically more accurate to the adventure—the dragon is green, and on top of one of the massive mushrooms in its cavern—but I definitely like Ekaterina’s art more.

The Hero's Handbook​

The Hero's Handbook kicks off with a solo adventure, a delightful little romp through a quick little cavern with a few nasties and quite a bit of treasure. My advice for those taking their own crack at it? Fortune favors the bold. The rest of the Hero’s Handbook concerns itself with expertly navigating a new player through the process of making a new character, complete with the colorful lettered circles that connect to spaces on the provided empty character sheets. Also, the Hero’s Handbook FINALLY does away with the difference between ability scores and ability modifiers—thank goodness.

The Game Master's Guide​

Like the Hero’s Handbook, the Game Master’s Guide kicks off with an adventure. As a GM and as an adventure designer, I do appreciate the way the adventure designers generally nail one-page sections for each room or encounter. Like with the solo adventure, there’s excellent escalation of challenges: first simple combat, then a combat with some saving throws, then skill checks, puzzles, persistent damage, and some undead to let the cleric shine in an offensive moment. Other nice spots of design include magical boon rewards and defending monsters getting some home turf advantages. Also, it must be said: this features a dragon in a dungeon. Points again!

My only real issues with the adventure was the tired artifact of XP—if we’re going to be doing away with ability scores and modifiers, just take the leap to milestone XP, especially if the Game Master’s Guide later insists all players advance equally anyway—and the climactic encounters seem a little lackluster. Perhaps it’s just a glut of excellent encounter design I’ve seen from other places lately, but I tend to expect a little more action from the environment. That said, this is an introductory adventure, and I wouldn’t want to throw a new GM too far into the deep end.

The rest of the Game Master’s Guide is simply excellent material for a new GM learning the ropes, and indeed is a fantastic refresher for experienced GMs wanting a straightforward and concise presentation of the fundamentals of running tabletop games in general and Pathfinder 2E in specific. My only issue with this section is that there's more ogre art in line with their supposed foul and flabby nature. I can tell this was a deliberate choice because much of the rest of the monster art, specifically that of the orcs, is lifted directly from the Bestiary. I will keep my ogres beautiful and beefy, thank you very much.

The Rest​

What’s left? Well, we have the fold-out maps, which are excellent and which absolutely require a full table to use properly. There are tokens for every monster that appears in the Game Master’s Guide, and even tokens for every ancestry/gender/class combination possible with the limited options available in the Hero’s Handbook. Also, some tokens with action and reaction symbols on them for use with the relevant spaces on the included character sheets.

In summary, the Pathfinder Beginner Box is an excellent introduction to the game for new solo players and new groups, and an excellent reintroduction for veterans looking for a refresh on the game’s core identity. Well worth the investment and guaranteed to be a hit at your table.
 

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Ben Reece

Ben Reece

CapnZapp

Legend
Until we hear what actually happened to Greywolf's group, I can't really accept the conclusion that the BB's rats encounter "gets your characters killed right off the bat" and moreover in a way that is unique to the PF2 BB. Greywolf's entire argument is based off of it. So until it's backed up, their entire argument will not convince many. If they seek to convince, they should clarify.
(my emphasis)

Well, your acceptance isn't really needed for the rest of us to accept that PF2 is a significantly more lethal game than, well, 5th Edition.

It's not that I'm saying Greywolf's players didn't make mistakes - it can well be that they made every newbie mistake in the book. But that just misses the point.

Going "you made a mistake and if you do this instead, those rats will be easy pickings" draws the wrong conclusion.
 

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CapnZapp

Legend
Funny; I thought people would consider that a feature? Since I remember complaints that level 1 PCs shouldn't be heroes and just be regular people? Didn't people pine for the old days where getting to level 2 was an achievement to celebrate? Don't you remember those threads where people complain that 5E is too easy on PCs? Maybe PF2 is built for them?
I'm not complaining. I'm trying to make Ronaldsf see that while he might have an easy time with PF2, his experiences aren't necessarily representative.
 

CapnZapp

Legend
I don't mind that style of game if it's a quick and loose OSR type game, where characters can be made in 5 minutes. This isn't the case with PF2. With all the customization, you really have to put care and attachment into your character, and it's not easy to just "jump back in" after losing a character (and I should know after my group's 3 TPKs). The system also demands a level of group tactical mastery, which you aren't going to be able to develop when going through so many rosters of PCs.
It's like blending the recipes of 1e, 3e, and 4e. Some of the flavors don't complement each other.
PF2 definitely expects you to put a lot of care into building a character and accepting that every combat can easily turn ugly with just a little bad dice luck. The actual risk of dying isn't nearly as great as the illusion of threat (which is one of PF2's greatest accomplishments) but you can definitely die. And at the lowest levels, you can die through no fault of your own, which of course few players find fun. (At first level, you can go from fully healed to instantly dead from the GM just rolling a single '20' on her attack dice.)

Having to scrap all your work on your character as well as your plans for his or her development is definitely a price you need to think is worth paying, in order to get the maximum thrill from exciting and truly difficult fights.

So yep, I would agree your capacity for enjoying Pathfinder 2 definitely depends on your ability to adopt a mercenary mindset where you remain somewhat callous to the fate of your own character!

Of course, you can also use modern-day tactics where you focus on denying monsters their attacks, drawing back to force monsters to continuously come to you, seeking cover at every opportunity, and so on. This undoubtedly makes the game considerably easier, but I'm talking "traditional" fantasy combat here, where players expect their Barbarians and what not to heroically wade into combat and just squash the puny foes.

Well, in PF2 most foes just aren't that puny.

At least not during single-digit levels. (At level 11+ and especially level 15+ your life as an adventurer gets to be much easier, almost like in D&D 5E)
 

PF2 definitely expects you to put a lot of care into building a character and accepting that every combat can easily turn ugly with just a little bad dice luck. The actual risk of dying isn't nearly as great as the illusion of threat (which is one of PF2's greatest accomplishments) but you can definitely die. And at the lowest levels, you can die through no fault of your own, which of course few players find fun. (At first level, you can go from fully healed to instantly dead from the GM just rolling a single '20' on her attack dice.)

Having to scrap all your work on your character as well as your plans for his or her development is definitely a price you need to think is worth paying, in order to get the maximum thrill from exciting and truly difficult fights.

So yep, I would agree your capacity for enjoying Pathfinder 2 definitely depends on your ability to adopt a mercenary mindset where you remain somewhat callous to the fate of your own character!

Of course, you can also use modern-day tactics where you focus on denying monsters their attacks, drawing back to force monsters to continuously come to you, seeking cover at every opportunity, and so on. This undoubtedly makes the game considerably easier, but I'm talking "traditional" fantasy combat here, where players expect their Barbarians and what not to heroically wade into combat and just squash the puny foes.

Well, in PF2 most foes just aren't that puny.

At least not during single-digit levels. (At level 11+ and especially level 15+ your life as an adventurer gets to be much easier, almost like in D&D 5E)
I find this argument disingenuous. At first level, character creation is not much more time consuming than 5e.

”And at the lowest levels, you can die through no fault of your own”.

Just as you can in 5e, 3e and Ad&d. This is not a trait particular to PF2. Now absolutely, you can argue around the lethality and difficulty of combat within PF2 as a game and whether that level of challenge is your cup of tea.

Here, the specific discussion is around the beginner box encounter, particularly the rats as the first. I hold that that encounter is no more lethal than the initial goblin encounter in phandelver and in fact, perhaps more generous to the players.

The vast majority of these encounters in the starter box are perfectly approachable to any beginner, subject to the whims of RNGeesus which is a factor of any beginning levels.
 

dave2008

Legend
I find this argument disingenuous. At first level, character creation is not much more time consuming than 5e.
I've heard a lot of people disagree with this. Now I am much more familiar with 5e, but when I tried to make a rogue in PF2 I eventually gave up because it was taking to long. So it is definitely a thing for some.

Please not I did not play 3e or PF1, so this type of highly involved character creation was new to me. I did make quire a few 4e characters though.
 
Last edited:

ronaldsf

Explorer
(my emphasis)

Well, your acceptance isn't really needed for the rest of us to accept that PF2 is a significantly more lethal game than, well, 5th Edition.

It's not that I'm saying Greywolf's players didn't make mistakes - it can well be that they made every newbie mistake in the book. But that just misses the point.

Going "you made a mistake and if you do this instead, those rats will be easy pickings" draws the wrong conclusion.
But that's not what I'm saying. Every newbie mistake in the book should NOT have led to death against giant rats. UNLESS there was incredibly bad luck which is not unique to PF2, or they forgot the cleric could stabilize the dying (in which case that is a facepalm moment, and they're wrong to place blame on the BB adventure), or Greywolf wasn't telling the truth. I'm just trying to confirm it was the former (in which case the BB is not more guilty than any other starter adventure), since there are no other scenarios here.
 

I've heard a lot of people disagree with this. Now I am much more familiar with 5e, but when I tried to make a rouge in PF2 I eventually gave up because it was taking to long. So it is definitely a thing for some.

Please not I did not play 3e or PF1, so this type of highly involved character creation was new to me. I did make quire a few 4e characters though.

For first level? Was this in the beginner box or the CRB? Either way, I’m really confused as to how this is possible as both include a step by step guide on how to do and where in the sheet to fill that information. It is a hand holding process that I think is superior to how it’s explained in 5E. You are literally walked through the ABCs (Ancestry, Background and Class) and choose from a very limited list of options in a number of pools at each step at level 1.

Im saying this not to belittle you, far from it, I am just genuinely confused as I felt this guide was a strong point of both books. Though I appreciate I have a background in PF 1. Could you maybe shed some light on what you found difficult or confusing from your perspective as someone who hadn’t played PF1?
 

Nilbog

Snotling Herder
I've looked at the rats encounter in the beginners box, and it doesn't strike me as a tpk waiting to happen, on paper it looks at most a moderate encounter, however we all know that things rarely go as written.
I believe a way they could improve it is to remove critical hits from the encounter, mention in a sidebar about them and say they'll be covered later. I think doing that would make any tpk incredibly unlikely.
 

dave2008

Legend
For first level? Was this in the beginner box or the CRB? Either way, I’m really confused as to how this is possible as both include a step by step guide on how to do and where in the sheet to fill that information. It is a hand holding process that I think is superior to how it’s explained in 5E. You are literally walked through the ABCs (Ancestry, Background and Class) and choose from a very limited list of options in a number of pools at each step at level 1.

Im saying this not to belittle you, far from it, I am just genuinely confused as I felt this guide was a strong point of both books. Though I appreciate I have a background in PF 1. Could you maybe shed some light on what you found difficult or confusing from your perspective as someone who hadn’t played PF1?
It was the CRB. This was when it first came out so I don't remember too well. However, I don't think I followed a step-by-step guide. I'm a bit of a jump in and do it yourself type, so that may have been my down fall. I also remember reading through the whole class, not just 1st level, so that may have been issue too.
 

It was the CRB. This was when it first came out so I don't remember too well. However, I don't think I followed a step-by-step guide. I'm a bit of a jump in and do it yourself type, so that may have been my down fall. I also remember reading through the whole class, not just 1st level, so that may have been issue too.
Yeah that will do it! PF2 offers a whole suite of options and if you jump in without understanding, you’re going to come unstuck very fast. The beauty of all those silos is that you only need to look at a limited number of options at each decision point (as opposed to the massive feat menu of pf1).
I would be willing to put money on 1st level character creation not being much longer than 5e if you follow the steps (bar indecision around what abilities you want from each option choice).
 

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