Pathfinder 1E Pathfinder: Mystic Theurge Min/Max--Advice please!

[iwarrior-poet]

Stepping back into role playing with a new Pathfinder campaign. Pretty pumped about it, since I have been away from dice rolling for 3+ years now. I never really bought into 4e and enjoyed 3.5 so I am hoping Pathfinder is a good fit. The gamemaster is generally staying to the PRD, with a homebrew campaign world.

My group is very small (myself and another PC), so I thought I would go with the versatile Mystic Theurge for an eventual Prestige class--probably with a Cleric/Wizard 3/3 base.

Here's my question---what are some good ways I can min/max here? I will be losing 3 spellcaster levels in order to pick up the MT, so what are some good feats/domains/skills/items I should be concentrating on? Thoughts? Thanks for any responses.

(and I apologize if this is a repitition, I did a few searches, but couldn't find any similar threads)

 

[Melvin the Mediocre]

I thought I would go with the versatile Mystic Theurge for an eventual Prestige class--what are some good ways I can min/max here?

According to the FAQ spell like abilities and certain domain powers can qualify you for Mystic Theurge, which means there are several ways to get into the class with only a 1 level dip instead of a 3 level dip. The 1st level power of the trickery domain is ruled to be based on mirror image, so lets you play any race as a cleric 3/wizard 1/MT x.

Many of the races such as Aasimar have a spell like ability of a second level spell. Note that if a spell appears on both the wizard list and the cleric list, it is vexingly ruled to be an arcane spell. But this gives you some options to play a few different races with any domains.

The only 2nd level divine sla I have found is from summon nature's ally 2 which comes from the Agathion-Blooded race which has only no bonus to mental stats. This is a little dissapointing to me, but since wizard spell lists are far superior to cleric spell lists, it would let effectively play a full wizard with only a 1 level dip into cleric.

By level 20, a cleric 1/wizard 9/MT 20 would loose 3 feats, 1 8th level spell, 1 9th level spell, and some powers to its familiar, and some of the school power (one gimped a little, one gimped a lot, and the capstone will not be acheived. Also int will be 2 points lower than a typical wizard spell, so save dcs will be one lower and there will be one less skill. Also you will only get 9 levels of favored class.

It would gain +1 to will saves, +2 to fort saves, and the full casting ability of an 11th level cleric, and two possible useful domain powers. I see this as a pretty even trade off, but if I could find a way to do it with a race that gets a bonus to int, I think it would be a lot more fair.

 

[iwarrior-poet]

Which FAQ? I am not seeing it on the Paizo website---and I don't want to get into a snit with a new GM over an unofficial interpretation of the rules---since the PRD says under requirements, "Spells: Able to cast 2nd-level divine spells and 2nd-level arcane spells."

I also don't want to appear to be an overly demanding min/maxing rules lawyer---but I don't want to be punished for being flexible for the group.

Walking that fine line...

 

[Melvin the Mediocre]

Looking again, I see there are some options under aasimar that your dm may or may not allow.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/other-races/featured-races/arg-aasimar

"GMs may customize their aasimar NPCs using the following chart, or allow their players to do so by rolling a d%. Players with a particular character concept in mind may consult their GM if they want to select a specific variant ability."

This list has a number of divine sla's including spear of purity, weapon of awe, aid, augury, zone of truth, remove disease, blessing of courage and life.

 

[TwoSix]

If you want some spell versatility without taking the hit to raw power that a Mystic Theurge, take a look at the Witch class. Many good arcane spells, plus a full array of cures. And the hexes are gravy on top.

 

[Melvin the Mediocre]

Which FAQ? I am not seeing it on the Paizo website

http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fm#v5748eaic9nib

Spell-Like Abilities, Casting, and Prerequisites: Does a creature with a spell-like ability count as being able to cast that spell for the purpose of prerequisites or requirements?

Yes.
For example, the Dimensional Agility feat (Ultimate Combat) has "ability to use the abundant step class feature or cast dimension door" as a prerequisite; a barghest has dimension door as a spell-like ability, so the barghest meets the "able to cast dimension door prerequisite for that feat.

Edit 7/12/13: The design team is aware that the above answer means that certain races can gain access to some spellcaster prestige classes earlier than the default minimum (character level 6). Given that prestige classes are usually a sub-optimal character choice (especially for spellcasters), the design team is allowing this FAQ ruling for prestige classes. If there is in-play evidence that this ruling is creating characters that are too powerful, the design team may revisit whether or not to allow spell-like abilities to count for prestige class requirements.

—Pathfinder Design Team, 06/06/13

 

[TwoSix]

Oh wow, that's a pretty clearcut ruling. I guess you could combine this with Magical Lineage and Heighten Spell to do a Wizard2/Cleric1/MTX build?

 

[Melvin the Mediocre]

That is not allowed, as I recall also in the faq. I also just saw that you do not get to add two free spells to your spell book when you level up. I think that is super bogus, but thems the rules.