Pathfinder 1E Pathfinder questions? Good as it sounds?

[Otterscrubber]

I am considering getting into pathfinder for several reasons. The novelty of D&D 4e has worn off and the person I play most D&D is tired and wants to go back to 3e. Looks like pathfinder would be the way to go if we are going to play a game based on 3e and it sounds like they have done a lot of good work. I have some questions though:

1) One of the problems I had with 3e is that it highly favored casters as levels progressed. If you weren't a caster you were often limited in your ability to be versatile or for heavy damage output in a lot of scenarios. Does Pathfinder address this?

2) Does pathfinder deal with "epic" levels well? the D&D 3e system for epic i felt was incredibly open ended to the point where it was hard keep things balanced. And it accentuated the issues I have in #1 above. If you were' t a caster with epic spells you needed to work with one.

Thanks for any feedback. I'm thinking of buying the core book for me and both main books for my brother as a xmas gift but would like some feedback before spending $$ on it.

 

[DaveMage]

I'm playing in a Pathfinder game now at level 10.

1. Without the fighter in the party, we'd be toast. I'm not saying casters won't rule eventually, but not through level 10.

2. Paizo does not yet have an epic ruleset. They are calling the ruleset "mythic", but there have been no announced plans as to when we will actually see it. If you're looking for epic (level 20+ play) 3.5 is still your best bet.

 

[IronWolf]

I am considering getting into pathfinder for several reasons. The novelty of D&D 4e has worn off and the person I play most D&D is tired and wants to go back to 3e. Looks like pathfinder would be the way to go if we are going to play a game based on 3e and it sounds like they have done a lot of good work. I have some questions though:

I agree. If you are looking to go back to 3.x type system, Pathfinder would be an excellent choice.

1) One of the problems I had with 3e is that it highly favored casters as levels progressed. If you weren't a caster you were often limited in your ability to be versatile or for heavy damage output in a lot of scenarios. Does Pathfinder address this?

Keeping in mind I tend to think this issue was a bit exaggerated in several cases (or at least this didn't seem to be a major issue in our 3.x campaigns)...

Pathfinder did seek to make sure there were no dead levels for characters as they advanced which ups the power level of a lot of classes a bit. In my current campaign the fighter and paladin still shine quite frequently. Where the wizard has his moments of glory it is against a larger number of critters. So when that chain lightning fires off it does have devastating effect in that he can really spread the damage about. Against single foes that are designed to be a reasonable challenge the fighter and paladin do just fine in damage output in comparison to the wizard in the group.

2) Does pathfinder deal with "epic" levels well? the D&D 3e system for epic i felt was incredibly open ended to the point where it was hard keep things balanced. And it accentuated the issues I have in #1 above. If you were' t a caster with epic spells you needed to work with one.

No epic ruleset as DaveMage stated.

Thanks for any feedback. I'm thinking of buying the core book for me and both main books for my brother as a xmas gift but would like some feedback before spending $$ on it.

I think they are a good purchase. There is a lot of fun to be had with this system.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I am considering getting into pathfinder for several reasons. The novelty of D&D 4e has worn off and the person I play most D&D is tired and wants to go back to 3e. Looks like pathfinder would be the way to go if we are going to play a game based on 3e and it sounds like they have done a lot of good work. I have some questions though:

IMHO, there are several excellent 3.X games out there, of which Pathfinder is but one. All have their improvements, all have their goofs. None is "better" than 3.5 to me, just different.

Personally, I like (in no particular order):

Pathfinder
Arcana Unearthed/Arcana Evolved
Midnight 2Ed
True20
FantasyCraft
Mutants & Masterminds' Warriors & Warlocks ruleset.

 

[Nightson]

1) One of the problems I had with 3e is that it highly favored casters as levels progressed. If you weren't a caster you were often limited in your ability to be versatile or for heavy damage output in a lot of scenarios. Does Pathfinder address this?

Pathfinder tries hard to make all classes interesting, but they don't try and make them balanced. Damage wise I actually wouldn't be surprised if the average melee character outdamaged the average spellcaster.

But full casters are still umatched for versatility and general power. Pathfinder makes it a bit harder for a caster to replicate the other roles, but the game is definitely not 4e, a party with a full caster will be much stronger then one without.

Though of course this difference doesn't become pronounced until you start hitting the upper levels.

 

[Otterscrubber]

Excellent feedback, thank you all!

 

[SteveC]

I'd say that Pathfinder has largely the same positives, but also the same issues as D&D 3X. If you largely liked 3X, you'll find it very easy to get into.

If you're looking for something a little different, but still using the 3X base, I'd suggest looking at Fantasycraft: it's the only version of the 3X ruleset that I've found made enough changes for me to address my problems with the core 3X OGL rules.

The obvious advantage with Pathfinder is that you get access to the amazing adventures that Paizo puts out, so you (or your GM if you're going to play) know you'll have that.

I think it all comes down to how happy you were with 3X: if you had modest objections at best, then I think you'll really like Pathfinder.

One thing that I do suggest: don't try and play a "blended" campaign with the old 3X WotC rules: one of the best things that Pathfinder did was to ditch the baggage of the later designs that WotC did for 3X (they didn't have a choice with this: things like Book of 9 Swords weren't OGL). While you can use those things, I think you'll be happier with the rebalancing that Paizo did when they re-presented some of those concepts.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

Pathfinder is ok, but I'd recommend you just go back to 3E, especially if you have some of the splats to make the base classes more interesting w/ alternate class features and the like. Overall it's a more balanced product. It has some grotesquely overpowered elements, but these are all fairly commonly known and easy to ban.

As for your questions... PF Fighter is identical to 3E Fighter, except he can do even more damage and have even higher AC. His only real gain for noncombat situations was the new skill system, where something being a class skill is nearly meaningless. The class itself is still all about hitting things hard and relying on a d10 HD and heavy armor to protect you.

As for question 2, as others have said, PF hasn't dared even touch epic levels. PF shys away from a lot of controversial things that 3E needed fixed (another is the LA system, they just ducked out of the entire monsters as PCs thing altogether). I give 3E credit for at least trying and (mostly, but not completely) failing.

Danny has a good list of other d20 games, too. I particularly like Arcane Evolved/Unearthed. It's also not perfect, but a very cool game.

 

[Wycen]

PF shys away from a lot of controversial things that 3E needed fixed (another is the LA system, they just ducked out of the entire monsters as PCs thing altogether). I give 3E credit for at least trying and (mostly, but not completely) failing.

Actually they have released a playtest version of character race builder. So they are not dodging that issue, just took some time for them to develop a system, which is still open to playtest if you go to paizo.com.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

Ah, good to know. Hopefully they won't overreact to exotic monster races and confuse "different" for "powerful." On the other hand, iirc SKR wrote Savage Species, my 2nd most hated book of 3E (and most hated 3.0 book) and one of the only ones I ban in its entirety...