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<blockquote data-quote="MostlyDm" data-source="post: 6785345" data-attributes="member: 6788973"><p>I definitely like your suggestions, Shadowdweller, there's some great stuff in there about possibly using the frightened condition. I like that. You're probably right about immunity being too good at any level, even costing concentration/causing exhaustion. Damn. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite3" alt=":(" title="Frown :(" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":(" /></p><p></p><p>And Unwise, that potion idea is stellar. Thanks! </p><p></p><p>In general, though, I don't really agree with the suggestions to balance an overpowered combat mechanic with roleplaying penalties. Mainly because I already screw with my players constantly when it comes to roleplaying, and I have total buy-in from them for that. Half the reason the player is really looking forward to being a wererat is precisely because she's looking forward to the challenge of roleplaying the ratlike tendencies (hoarding, skittishness, etc), and getting herself and the group into all sorts of trouble because of it. That's the point of the game, after all.</p><p></p><p>When you get down to it, most "roleplay" penalties aren't penalties unless the player really doesn't like what you're doing and feels that you're denying him agency. Which... is a problem actually, and you probably shouldn't treat your players like that. But in this case, it's not much of an issue. The only roleplay penalty that really has teeth is taking away the character from her entirely.</p><p></p><p>Which means instead of being a sliding scale of "more and more RP issues culminating in character confiscation" what's being suggested is actually "more and more fun and interesting roleplay experiences culminating in character confiscation." Which sounds a whole lot more arbitrary and cruel (...because it is.)</p><p></p><p>So... I'm not interested in confiscating anyone's character. Heck, I've happily run characters that actively tried to kill each other (or even their own rival characters), and it was a blast. As long as the players are handling things well and having fun, I'd much rather keep letting them play and see how things turn out.</p><p></p><p>It would also kind of be a cop-out to say that being a wererat makes you descend deeper and deeper into total inhuman savagery, since I've specifically built up the Family as being a relatively civilized organization. After all, they're intelligent, lawful evil, and generally lack the savage murderous tendencies of, say, werewolves. One of their members has worked cooperatively alongside the party for mutual benefit for the last few sessions.</p><p></p><p>It may be that the general difficulty of becoming more ratlike will lead to her eventually seeking a cure. But I'd much rather be prepared for the possibility that she enjoys those challenges, and try to address the more fundamental balance concern behind resistance/immunity to nonmagic nonsilver weapons. I'm just not sure I've eyeballed the balance issue correctly.</p><p></p><p>Maybe I should have put this thread in homebrew...? Doesn't get much traffic, though. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite3" alt=":(" title="Frown :(" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":(" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="MostlyDm, post: 6785345, member: 6788973"] I definitely like your suggestions, Shadowdweller, there's some great stuff in there about possibly using the frightened condition. I like that. You're probably right about immunity being too good at any level, even costing concentration/causing exhaustion. Damn. :( And Unwise, that potion idea is stellar. Thanks! In general, though, I don't really agree with the suggestions to balance an overpowered combat mechanic with roleplaying penalties. Mainly because I already screw with my players constantly when it comes to roleplaying, and I have total buy-in from them for that. Half the reason the player is really looking forward to being a wererat is precisely because she's looking forward to the challenge of roleplaying the ratlike tendencies (hoarding, skittishness, etc), and getting herself and the group into all sorts of trouble because of it. That's the point of the game, after all. When you get down to it, most "roleplay" penalties aren't penalties unless the player really doesn't like what you're doing and feels that you're denying him agency. Which... is a problem actually, and you probably shouldn't treat your players like that. But in this case, it's not much of an issue. The only roleplay penalty that really has teeth is taking away the character from her entirely. Which means instead of being a sliding scale of "more and more RP issues culminating in character confiscation" what's being suggested is actually "more and more fun and interesting roleplay experiences culminating in character confiscation." Which sounds a whole lot more arbitrary and cruel (...because it is.) So... I'm not interested in confiscating anyone's character. Heck, I've happily run characters that actively tried to kill each other (or even their own rival characters), and it was a blast. As long as the players are handling things well and having fun, I'd much rather keep letting them play and see how things turn out. It would also kind of be a cop-out to say that being a wererat makes you descend deeper and deeper into total inhuman savagery, since I've specifically built up the Family as being a relatively civilized organization. After all, they're intelligent, lawful evil, and generally lack the savage murderous tendencies of, say, werewolves. One of their members has worked cooperatively alongside the party for mutual benefit for the last few sessions. It may be that the general difficulty of becoming more ratlike will lead to her eventually seeking a cure. But I'd much rather be prepared for the possibility that she enjoys those challenges, and try to address the more fundamental balance concern behind resistance/immunity to nonmagic nonsilver weapons. I'm just not sure I've eyeballed the balance issue correctly. Maybe I should have put this thread in homebrew...? Doesn't get much traffic, though. :( [/QUOTE]
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