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<blockquote data-quote="Snarf Zagyg" data-source="post: 9017987" data-attributes="member: 7023840"><p>....and if sand was water, I'd drown in the Sahara.</p><p></p><p>Look, it's great and all to imagine hypothetical worlds that have these "flipped" characters and people make the exact same complaints, but somehow ignore the issues. But ... we don't have those hypothetical worlds, do we? We have an actual world, an actual world in which we constantly have people complain about female characters, and POC characters, and queer characters, and so on. A world where, for the most part, certain people (like Scott Bakula) are just considered a boring part of a forgettable show ... you know, the one that torpedoed Star Trek as a television series and a network ... while other people (Sonequa Martin-Green) are constantly pilloried as tokens and Mary Sues and the entire show is rubbished, despite helping launch a streaming service and ushering in a new golden age of Star Trek shows.</p><p></p><p>Again, that's not to say there can't be valid criticism of characters- something I'm more than happy to engage in. But the use of the word "token" or the idea that we need to cater to the prejudices of bigots is not something I'm particularly comfortable with. Finally, these are concepts that actually hurt real people- every time someone makes that "token" argument, there's another character that might not get written. There's another actor that might not get a role.</p><p></p><p>If you think Adira is boring? That's fine. Do you think Adira is too .... Wesley-like? Okay! But let's stop with the "token" argument. It's offensive.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Snarf Zagyg, post: 9017987, member: 7023840"] ....and if sand was water, I'd drown in the Sahara. Look, it's great and all to imagine hypothetical worlds that have these "flipped" characters and people make the exact same complaints, but somehow ignore the issues. But ... we don't have those hypothetical worlds, do we? We have an actual world, an actual world in which we constantly have people complain about female characters, and POC characters, and queer characters, and so on. A world where, for the most part, certain people (like Scott Bakula) are just considered a boring part of a forgettable show ... you know, the one that torpedoed Star Trek as a television series and a network ... while other people (Sonequa Martin-Green) are constantly pilloried as tokens and Mary Sues and the entire show is rubbished, despite helping launch a streaming service and ushering in a new golden age of Star Trek shows. Again, that's not to say there can't be valid criticism of characters- something I'm more than happy to engage in. But the use of the word "token" or the idea that we need to cater to the prejudices of bigots is not something I'm particularly comfortable with. Finally, these are concepts that actually hurt real people- every time someone makes that "token" argument, there's another character that might not get written. There's another actor that might not get a role. If you think Adira is boring? That's fine. Do you think Adira is too .... Wesley-like? Okay! But let's stop with the "token" argument. It's offensive. [/QUOTE]
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