Pitiful Monk, your speed impresses me not.

[KarinsDad]

He was not saying that you can use ER with flying. He was only saying that you can run when flying.

The poster is the only person who mentioned ER.

so, umm, dude, you're wrong.

Yes, I knew someone would only read one post back.

Numion's original "you can't run while flying" post meant that you cannot double your run pace with ER when flying, not that you could not multiply your Fly speed by 4 with a run action.

So, although frankthedm's post was technically correct, it was erroneous in reference.

And, therefore, you cannot RUN when FLYING.

So, umm, dude, you're wrong.

 

[Azardu]

I'm not an expert at physics, far from it, but when you consider that the spell in mention allows you to move your "transportational limbs" (feet) faster than normal, it would seem kind of reasonable that for a creature with alternative sets of "transportational limbs", it would affect those instead. It makes your feet move quicker (most likely), so why not your wings (faster flapping wings builds momentum faster, right?). Of course, physics do not apply to D&D, but common sense should. Well, in some cases at least.

Hope this makes at least a wee bit of sense...

Az

 

[KarinsDad]

I'm not an expert at physics, far from it, but when you consider that the spell in mention allows you to move your "transportational limbs" (feet) faster than normal, it would seem kind of reasonable that for a creature with alternative sets of "transportational limbs", it would affect those instead. It makes your feet move quicker (most likely), so why not your wings (faster flapping wings builds momentum faster, right?). Of course, physics do not apply to D&D, but common sense should. Well, in some cases at least.

Hope this makes at least a wee bit of sense...

Az

It would make sense if that is what the spell said.

But, the spell says "fleetness of foot, enabling you to run in great leaps and bounds". Not wings, not flippers.

Let's take an different example. If you can move your feet faster, could you swim faster? Technically according to reality, yes. Literally according to the spell, no. The spell does not state that because you are so quick with your feet that you get a bonus to swimming. A given DM might house rule that because it makes some semblance of sense, but that is not what the spell states.

Hence, no increase in speed for anything other than running (not taking the run action with a different type of movement) and jumping.

 

[Azardu]

http://www.opengamingfoundation.org/srd/srdcarryingmovingseeing.html

And I quote:
"Creatures can use the run action while flying, provided they fly in a straight line."

Guess there is a bit of common sense to be found, after all.

Technically, you can not run while flying, but according to the rules, you can.

Sometimes people amaze me by the way they are taking things to the letter rather than employing common sense. No offense meant.

 

[Nightfall]

This is where Monte's spell "Zone of Speed" would work wonders. "Nothing can more more than two feet in this area of the Grand Cayon!"

 

[Zerovoid]

It would make sense if that is what the spell said.

But, the spell says "fleetness of foot, enabling you to run in great leaps and bounds". Not wings, not flippers.

Let's take an different example. If you can move your feet faster, could you swim faster? Technically according to reality, yes. Literally according to the spell, no. The spell does not state that because you are so quick with your feet that you get a bonus to swimming. A given DM might house rule that because it makes some semblance of sense, but that is not what the spell states.

Hence, no increase in speed for anything other than running (not taking the run action with a different type of movement) and jumping.

I think the only part of the spell that counts is this:

Your speed and maximum jumping distances both double. These benefits count as enhancement bonuses.

The rest of the spell description is just there for flavor. If it was really part of the spell affect that it only increased walking speed, that would have been put in the SRD.

If there was a spell that said:

Its harder for your opponents to damage you. You gain damage resistence 5/-.

Would you try to argue that it didn't help you if you fell, or a rock crushed you, because they aren't your opponents?

 

[Rogue]

It would make sense if that is what the spell said.

But, the spell says "fleetness of foot, enabling you to run in great leaps and bounds". Not wings, not flippers...

...Hence, no increase in speed for anything other than running (not taking the run action with a different type of movement) and jumping.

Uhmm... no, it doesn't. The spell has been posted on here once before, but I'll bring it out just in case you missed it...

From the SRD

Expeditious Retreat

Transmutation
Level: Brd 1, Sor/Wiz 1, Travel 1
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: Personal
Target: The character
Duration: 1 minute/level (D)

The character's speed and maximum jumping distances both double. These benefits count as enhancement bonuses.

And just as Zerovoid said, that's all that matters. If the bit about running and hoping really counted, would they leave it out.

Nope.

Yet on a .txt file with the intention of providing the rules and nothing more, would they leave it out?

Yep.

That has been the rule through at least one reprint of the PHB, and it's still there. Flavor text has gotten in the way before, as well, and it was taken care of as needed. I believe it was Weapon Finesse and having one hand open for balance... all flavor text. Correct me if I'm wrong, please. I would rather not look like an ass when trying to present/justify false information.

Rogue

 

[Cl1mh4224rd]

Uhmm... no, it doesn't.

uhmm... yeah it does.

does no one ever read the player's handbook anymore??

i'm not going to type it out, so you're gonna have to get off your lazy ass and open up the damn book.

but reading the spell description, i would have to say that, as an in-game explaination, the spell was not designed to include flying creatures. the last paragraph of the description clearly implies that it was designed by wizards (not the company, the class) to get their frail little asses as far away from combat as possible.

that being said, i really don't see why, mechanically, it would be limited to "ground walkers".

 

[green slime]

Cool idea there, about the dragon.

but back to the hijack: to me it seems obvious that "flavour text" is what is causing the confusion.

 

[Azardu]

While on the subject of reading the books, has anyone read the Monster Manual before they replied to this topic?

Page 7, under Flying:

Creatures can use the run action while flying provided they fly in a straight line.

And if a thing can use run while flying, he will not have much problem with extremely fleetness of foot, which is only said in the description of the spell, not the actuall game mechanics it provides, which is indeed the doubling of moving and jumping distances in the form of an enhancment bonus.

What does in my opinion link Run and Expeditious retreat to each other is that while the description for them both might be a bit vague or even downright ambiguous, the game mechanics is what it is all about, not what is in my opinion merely an example for the use of it.

The reason they are called the Core Rulebooks is that they all together contain what makes the core rules. Looking at the Player's Handbook alone won't do.

Note: The reason I replied again, is mainly that people seem to have something against the SRD.

And if this still is not enough? Make up your own mechanism, that lets fliers move in a way equivalent to those with both feet on the ground, and a spell that gives those poor flying things the ability to double their movement (jumping distance wouldn't be needed here), like others can through Expeditious Retreat.