Psion class (Mearls, Happy Fun Hour)

[Aldarc]

Maybe I'll have a look when and if that becomes relevant. For the time being nothing indicates MMearls draws inspiration from anything except past TSR/WotC material.

I appreciate your rude dismissiveness, and I hope that I can return the favor should your posts ever become relevant.

Yep. Dreamscarred Press isn't a third party publisher for psionics, they're THE third party publisher for psionics. I think you could make a valid argument that Occult Adventures became what it was simply because DSP made doing a relatively straightforward Paizo adaption of 3.5 psionics a non starter.

Yeah, most definitely. Dreamscarred Press is followed on Twitter by Erik Mona, Paizo, and a number of other people who work with or for Paizo. So Paizo is definitely not ignorant about Dreamscarred Press. I would not be surprised to see DSP announce a system for PF2 psionics within the next year.

 

[gyor]

I appreciate your rude dismissiveness, and I hope that I can return the favor should your posts ever become relevant.

Yeah, most definitely. Dreamscarred Press is followed on Twitter by Erik Mona, Paizo, and a number of other people who work with or for Paizo. So Paizo is definitely not ignorant about Dreamscarred Press. I would not be surprised to see DSP announce a system for PF2 psionics within the next year.

Normally I'd call for civility, but honestly that was a pretty funny burn.

 

[TheCosmicKid]

Good ideas.

You could even have a Psion get an unrestricted power point scheme (because the restrictions in spell points are decidedly inelegant) and then warlockian once/day higher-level effects. The "level 6-9" powers would then be more like "level 5+" powers for balance. The number of PPs would then level off after level 5, since the higher-level effects don't cost PP.

I consider the warlock two-part system pretty inelegant, and would prefer not to see it replicated. If we do see something like a psionic wish (which is certainly thematically appropriate and we've seen it before), it'd be cleaner just to bake into the individual power "Once you've used this, you can't use it again until you finish a long rest" (or perhaps even longer).

 

[Tony Vargas]

Given the way warlocks work and various other things, I would surmise that WotC sees a strong qualitative distinction between 1st-5th-level magic and 6th-level-plus magic. That's clearly where the restriction in the spell point rules comes from. A full caster's eventual ability to get multiple 6th- and 7th-level slots, at the very highest of levels, should probably be regarded as an extremely qualified exception to the rule as a reward for getting that far, and not to be taken as precedent without careful consideration. If we're basing power points on the spell slot system, then as with the warlock, I think a 1x restriction on 6th-level-plus slots is inevitable.

I got the impression there was a stark dividing line between 1-5th & 6-9th level spells (magic-user spells, obviously, others it seemed like 1-4 vs 5-7)), c1984, if not earlier. In my campaign world (& variant rules) there was thus a distinction between 'Low Order' and 'High Order' spells.

Aside from the tenor of the spell just shifting dramatically, there were other indicators. The 1e discussion of Cleric spells had them learning lower level casting as a matter of faith/'devotion' but receiving 5th level spells from an intermediary, and 7th from the deity, itself, IIRC. The Magic-User's spell progression was to gain a new spell level at each odd numbered level, until 5th level spells at 9th, then you waited for 12th to get 6th level spells, and new spell levels at even class levels therafter to 9th @ 18th.

But if we're basing power points on the spell slot system, then really we should just use the spell slot system. If we're going to be switching to this new system with its heavy emphasis on flexibility, then immediately turning around to put slot-like restrictions on the system is pretty counterproductive. Instead, we should balance the 6th-plus psionic powers on the assumption that they will be used multiple times per day, rather than (as with spells) the assumption that they will not.

Or just, y'know, not map 'em to spells, at all.

 

[CapnZapp]

I appreciate your rude dismissiveness, and I hope that I can return the favor should your posts ever become relevant.

What I'm personally not fond of, is the repeated mention of a 3PP product I've never heard of, that probably doesn't factor into WotC's plans.

That's all. It's nothing personal, so please don't take it as such.

 

[Salthorae]

OTOH, 5th edition is by now an established success.
Maybe it's time to let the devs stretch their legs. Psionics is best when it feels different in a mechanical sense as well as any in-universe differences.

So these wouldn't feel different enough for you?

• concentrate on two effects at one time
• spells that stack onto on-going concentration cantrips
• point based system vs slot based

only one of those would be variant, the others coming from the new stuff MM is working on right now and over the last few weeks

 

[Aldarc]

What I'm personally not fond of, is the repeated mention of a 3PP product I've never heard of, that probably doesn't factor into WotC's plans.

That's all. It's nothing personal, so please don't take it as such.

That's okay. I'll be sure to cater my future contributions to threads on this forum to only things you have heard of.

 

[gyor]

That's okay. I'll be sure to cater my future contributions to threads on this forum to only things you have heard of.

Come on now shake hands and move on.

 

[gyor]

http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Halanan

This race from Star Trek is the perfect, maybe the perfect example of Psionic Constructor.

 

[jgsugden]

So these wouldn't feel different enough for you?
....

For me, psionics should not be spells. There may be a few psionics that duplicate the effects of spells, but if you're just going to make it into another form of spellcasting similar to wizard or cleric, you're not really giving us something worthwhile and distinct.

I'd rather you have something new. Example:

Psions gain 4 keywords at first level, and psychic warriors gain 3. Each class has a list of powers, and each power on the list has one or (more commonly) multiple keywords in their prerequisites. Psions and psychic warriors gain more keywords as they advance in levels. If a psi class has the prerequsities for a power they can use it - they 'know' all powers for which they have the prerequisites. When using a power there will be several options. Some uses require spell points, others do not. When they do not, the power level is similar to a cantrip. When they require points, the point cost may be specific for a given use, or follow an exponential progression to increase the efficacy. There would be nothing preventing a psi character from putting all of their psi into one use of one power - expect it might only be slightly more powerful than using half their psi points for a slightly weaker version or one quarter their psi for a more reasonable use.

They'd gain psi points as they advanced in level at an exponential rate, allowing them to burn off weaker uses of their power (with power levels on par with 1st and 2nd level spells) almost limitlessly (like a warlock with silent image or levitation can use them limitlessly) or make more uses of those powerful versions of powers as they advance. Reshape Reality might be the 'Wish' equivalent discussed above. If a psion devoted everything to it they might be able to use all their psi points to make it happen as early as 14th or 15th level... but if they want to use it and still have reasonable other options it will require level 17 or above.

Most class features would have a 'standard mode' and augmented modes that are accessed via power point usage, as well. Soul Knives can create basic knives at no psi point cost, but they can also trick out their blades by spending psi points on augmentations for that instance of their weapons.

As a side note - I would never use the word 'illusion' with psionics, but would rather use the concept of phantasms, meaning things they are convinced they see. Certain spells create phantasms (phantasmal force, phantasmal killer), but magical phantasms would be the lesser cousin of the psychic phantasms.