Pulling up a rope... with a PC attached

[Reaper Steve]

So the cleric was having a hard time climbing the 20' ledge in tonight's D&D Encounter. The knight decided to help her; I said, OK that's Aid Another to give her a +2 to her next climb check.

No, the knight explained, I am going to pull her up and she is going to do nothing but hold on.

Hmmm, so now I'm looking at STR stuff... 20 STR can lift 400lbs off the ground (heavy load), which is more than then dwarf in chain w/ heavy shield weighed.

OK, no problem, but should there be a check and how long should it take?
The knight isn't carrying the heavy load per se, so he's not slowed, but he wasn't moving anyway.

I ruled that it took the knight the full round (pulling 15' of rope with a PC attached) and that the dwarf had to delay until the knight's initiative next turn (essentially doing nothing the turn being hauled up 3 squares), but I didn't call for any type of check.

Thoughts?

Let's say that the ledge was some huge height, like 20 squares... How many squares would you let a character pull the rope per turn (or per action)?

 

[LightPhoenix]

It depends on the situation.

Out of battle, I'd make it a Strength check, maybe Athletics if someone was trained in the skill to represent weightlifting or tug-of-war or the like. The DC would depend on the conditions, but probably Moderate for a Medium creature and Easy for a Small one.

In battle, I would strongly discourage it. Without cooperation, off the cuff, I'd say same Easy/Moderate DC, Standard Action, and the PC would have two options: pull (move half speed, up same) or lift (one square up). While doing so, you'd grant combat advantage. Not great tactically.

 

[Reaper Steve]

Initiative was rolled, but they weren't in combat (through a combination of not being at the front line and the enemies hadn't revealed themselves yet.)

I was relcutant to make it a check because you're either strong enough or you're not.

Ultimately it didn't matter because the dwarf got up before the monsters emerged. But I want something in my bag of tricks in case it happens during a fight.

Maybe:
1) move action to pull up 1 sqaure (so possible to pull up 2/round.)
2) if the puller is hit and the damage exceeds his Fort defense, make a save or let go of the rope! or the slips 1 square per 5 HP damage over Fort Def.

 

[Saeviomagy]

If you're pulling someone up, and they don't fall off the rope, then there is no check involved: you either pull them up or you don't. The fact that you need to have spent an action throwing the rope down, the guy at the bottom has to spend an action securing himself, then you need to spend another action pulling them up already makes it more than enough of a pain to do mid-combat compared with the single move action that someone could spend to simply climb up.

And if it's outside of combat, then it really doesn't matter. It's an unattended pit-trap (at best) when the party have enough rope. Getting nitty-gritty about it isn't going to make it memorable or interesting: say it works and move on.

 

[Reaper Steve]

And if it's outside of combat, then it really doesn't matter. It's an unattended pit-trap (at best) when the party have enough rope. Getting nitty-gritty about it isn't going to make it memorable or interesting: say it works and move on.

I totally agree. It's just that, when they decided on this course of action we were already in encounter mode and depending on how I ruled it the pull could have stretched over a couple rounds. I elected not to have it do so, so it wound up not being an issue.

But it did make me wonder... what is a reasonable 'pull speed?'
I'm starting to think: your speed for a normal load and 2 squares for a heavy load per move action. Rationale: if the puller tied the rope around his waist and just started walking, he could walk his speed if the rope was attached to normal load or 2 squares if a heavy load

 

[Dr_Ruminahui]

I would take the heal checks as an example - spending a standard to have another character do as a standard or lesser action.

In this case, I would say the puller takes a standard action to make a climb test for the pullee, able to pull them at half the pulee's speed if they succeed.

 

[Hadrian the Builder]

Am I reading correctly that there are two questions: Should there be some kind of check, and if so, how fast does the player move up the wall?

My suggestions are:
1) There should only be a check if there are meaningful consequences for failure.
2) You should treat it exactly the same as a climb check, but the knight makes the check on behalf of the cleric, per the usual climb rules (so 1/2 speed as a move action).

Does that sound reasonable to you?

 

[Ryujin]

I would say that it becomes a moderate roll for the Knight, with the Cleric aiding. Same distance moved as if climbing.

 

[Scribble]

I would say:

Athletics check on the part of the knight. DC being based on how close to the 400lbs the Cleric was.

Make it sort of like a climb check- multiple missed fails means the Knight drops the Cleric- splat.


Half movement can't really hurt anything- but I guess if you wanted to you could do something similar to a jump check- with whatever the knight rolls determining the speed of ascent.

 

[jbear]

20 ft ... pft ... it's not very much now is it? I mean, most humans could reach 9/10 ft nearly with their arms stretched above their head. If you are talking about a massive height (as you said 200ft) that would be a far more challenging obstacle.

As for the cleric being hauled up the wall ... how undignified! Lazy trout! If I was doing the hauling I'd have been hurling abuse at him telling to move those chubby chocks! It would have probably been far easier to hang onto the rope, being pulled up as he assisted with his legs, like absailing but the other way around.

If there was no danger going on I'd have probably let it work with a both characters using their actions for that turn (minor to tie/untie, move and standard to heave, pull their way up and get back to their feet). But if it was outside of an encounter situation actions and turns are irrelevant. In which case I would probably just let them do it with a nod, a slight squinting of the eyes, and a sharp show of the teeth that isn't quite a smile, probably with some added comment about the undignified image of the cleric being hauled up the wall limply like a drowned fish.

If there was pressure, even if unbeknown to the pcs (monsters waiting to spring a trap), I might have set an easy DC Stregth check, just in case luck was to turn her face from the adventurers, giving the lurking monsters the perfect moment to spring the trap.

During combat I might make it more complicated to represent the confusion and series of errors that can occur when you are under pressure.
Dungeoneering (minor action) to secure the rope properly. If succeeded +2 to further checks to pull the PC up. If failed ... I'd be tempted to tell them everything was A Okay and then when that lazy cleric was half way up have him make a saving throw as the knot unravelled and he began to fall to the ground into the writhing snakes below! (where did those snakes come from!!!???!!)

Aid being Hauled up (Athletics Aid check; Move): Success +2 to lift checks Fail: -1 to check

As for the lifter:
Hauling up Lump-like Cleric: Standard Action Strength DC Moderate: Lift PC 2 squares (3 if he is Aiding the lift); For every 5 over the target DC the cleric is lifted another square.

Athletic Rope Action (adding skill to brute strength): Move action DC Difficult: Lift Cleric 1 extra square. For every 2 points rolled above the target DC, the cleric is lifted 1 more square. Succesful Aid checks made in the same round by the cleric also apply to this check. If the person lifting fails this check by more than 5 then the cleric drops back 1 square.

While this is going on, both would grant combat advantage.

Basically in a nut shell, the Cleric needs to tie the rope properly (someone is going to have to get that from their pack and throw it down to him as well), and then help out with being lifted (as opposed to the other way around). He can be a dead fish but that makes things slower; he's better off trying to help out) The lifter uses his brute strength to lift his ally; the stronger he is, the faster he lifts. He can also use his athletic skill to pull the rope up with good technique which can add further speed but runs the risk of tangling things up if he doesn't do it properly. While this goes on both make rather attractive targets.

That's how I would picture it if I had to resolve it. But like others have said, it would only become important if the situation had other dangers going on at the same moment, making time an important factor.