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question about spell immunity
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<blockquote data-quote="moritheil" data-source="post: 2463249" data-attributes="member: 30610"><p>Yes.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>This assertion is logically inconsistent with your first assertion.</p><p></p><p>Either they are the same spell, or they are not the same spell. Are they the same spell? Your answer is yes. Thus, by your answer, SI protects against a flame strike no matter who casts it, because flame strike is the same spell no matter who casts it.</p><p></p><p>The question of whether or not the spell has to be cast from a 4th level or lower SPELL SLOT is different from the question "Can I find this as a 4th level spell?" </p><p></p><p>If you wish to assert that a Cleric flame strike ignores the SI:flame strike but not a Druid flamestrike, you must also assert that they are not the same spell. SI does not protect against "all instances of a spell that are cast as 4th level or lower;" it protects against all castings of "a 4th level spell" on you - even if some poor class like Cleric gets shafted into picking up the spell later. Put another way, if they are the same spell, the fact that a cleric casts it does not change the fact that it is still flame strike.</p><p></p><p>Let me try it from another angle - the only way to say that the Cleric flame strike breaks through is to say that it is not a 4th level spell at all; it is a 5th level spell - and thus, it is a different spell. This has the undesirable side effect of making SI nearly completely worthless.</p><p></p><p>The attempt to mitigate this by processing the "fourth level or lower" check subsequent to the initial determination of the level of the spell is flawed. SI does not ask if the spell is <em>cast</em> as a fourth level or lower spell; it asks if it IS a fourth level or lower spell. Flame strike <em>happens to be</em> a fifth level slot for a cleric, but if you assert that it is the same as the druid spell, it is a fourth level spell, since that's what the druid spell is, and it is blocked by SI.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="moritheil, post: 2463249, member: 30610"] Yes. This assertion is logically inconsistent with your first assertion. Either they are the same spell, or they are not the same spell. Are they the same spell? Your answer is yes. Thus, by your answer, SI protects against a flame strike no matter who casts it, because flame strike is the same spell no matter who casts it. The question of whether or not the spell has to be cast from a 4th level or lower SPELL SLOT is different from the question "Can I find this as a 4th level spell?" If you wish to assert that a Cleric flame strike ignores the SI:flame strike but not a Druid flamestrike, you must also assert that they are not the same spell. SI does not protect against "all instances of a spell that are cast as 4th level or lower;" it protects against all castings of "a 4th level spell" on you - even if some poor class like Cleric gets shafted into picking up the spell later. Put another way, if they are the same spell, the fact that a cleric casts it does not change the fact that it is still flame strike. Let me try it from another angle - the only way to say that the Cleric flame strike breaks through is to say that it is not a 4th level spell at all; it is a 5th level spell - and thus, it is a different spell. This has the undesirable side effect of making SI nearly completely worthless. The attempt to mitigate this by processing the "fourth level or lower" check subsequent to the initial determination of the level of the spell is flawed. SI does not ask if the spell is [i]cast[/i] as a fourth level or lower spell; it asks if it IS a fourth level or lower spell. Flame strike [i]happens to be[/i] a fifth level slot for a cleric, but if you assert that it is the same as the druid spell, it is a fourth level spell, since that's what the druid spell is, and it is blocked by SI. [/QUOTE]
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