Racial stat increases

[Sander]

The other day I was playing dnd with my some friends, who didnt realy know the rules. They picked class race combinations which looked cool to them, such as elf warlock.
But the game actually punishes players that choose flavor over stats, because they are lagging behind with attack and damage rolls.

I'm thinking about a system where there are no racial stat increases. As a counterbalance, I want to increase point buy to compensate. I'm looking for a good number however.

Does anyone have experience with the apropriate number of point buy?

 

[Starfox]

As alternative, try this rule:

Every race gets a +2 bonus to any one attribute other than the ones they already get a bonus to.

This way, your Elf Warlock can have a bonus to Cha, Con, Or Int (as appropriate). No race is clearly a looser at any class anymore.

 

[Tequila Sunrise]

The other day I was playing dnd with my some friends, who didnt realy know the rules. They picked class race combinations which looked cool to them, such as elf warlock.
But the game actually punishes players that choose flavor over stats, because they are lagging behind with attack and damage rolls.

I'm thinking about a system where there are no racial stat increases. As a counterbalance, I want to increase point buy to compensate. I'm looking for a good number however.

Does anyone have experience with the apropriate number of point buy?

Well a reasonably optimized character will have a +2 to at least his primary stat, usually. That's 7 point buys (16 to 18 = 7). If you want to assume that characters should get a +2 to their secondary stat, that's another 4 point buys (14 to 16 = 4). So I'd suggest somewhere between 29 to 33 points.

Alternatively, my own house rules is that humans get a second +2 and other races can move one of their +2s to a different stat. Players can't stack two bonuses onto one score to get a +4.

 

[Tequila Sunrise]

The other day I was playing dnd with my some friends, who didnt realy know the rules. They picked class race combinations which looked cool to them, such as elf warlock.
But the game actually punishes players that choose flavor over stats, because they are lagging behind with attack and damage rolls.

I'm thinking about a system where there are no racial stat increases. As a counterbalance, I want to increase point buy to compensate. I'm looking for a good number however.

Does anyone have experience with the apropriate number of point buy?

Well a reasonably optimized character will have a +2 to at least his primary stat, usually. That's 7 point buys (16 to 18 = 7). If you want to assume that characters should get a +2 to their secondary stat, that's another 4 point buys (14 to 16 = 4). So I'd suggest somewhere between 29 to 33 points.

Alternatively, my own house rules is that humans get a second +2 and other races can move one of their +2s to a different stat. Players can't stack two bonuses onto one score to get a +4.

 

[DragoonLance]

Alternatively, my own house rules is that humans get a second +2 and other races can move one of their +2s to a different stat. Players can't stack two bonuses onto one score to get a +4.

I'll second this, it has worked great for my group of non-optimizers.

 

[eriktheguy]

Alternatively, my own house rules is that humans get a second +2 and other races can move one of their +2s to a different stat. Players can't stack two bonuses onto one score to get a +4.

This choice makes the human race overpowered (they get +1 to all defenses to make up for their missing ability score bonus). You could always allow the non-human races to choose one of their ability score bonuses as you described without changing humans at all. I doubt it will cause problems. If your friends are making non-optimized PCs, then I can't see them abusing this. Humans don't need any change because they are easy to optimize for any class.

Remember that not all races need a fix just because their ability scores APPEAR non optimal for their class. Your dwarf fighter gets a feat that lets him gain proficiency and +2 damage with any hammer, making up for his low strength score.

But in the case of the elf warlock, you could let the player switch Dex to Int or Wis to Cha without any real issue. (Another possible rule is that non-humans can switch one of their ability bonuses for another in the same category. For example, con to str, dex to int, cha to wis).

 

[Kzach]

I've DM'd two groups now (one to 5th-level and one only to 2nd) with a house rule that replaces ALL racial stat bonuses with two stat bonuses, each of +2.

The player can place these bonuses anywhere they please but only one to a stat. I've found it creates more interesting combinations and doesn't pigeonhole races to certain classes.

The argument that it makes humans the most powerful race I feel is redundant. No player in either group has so far preferred humans over any other race. And in fact, I've determined the opposite effect, where now players are far freer to choose interesting class and race combinations, and they don't feel forced into some cookie-cutter build.

 

[Tequila Sunrise]

This choice makes the human race overpowered (they get +1 to all defenses to make up for their missing ability score bonus). You could always allow the non-human races to choose one of their ability score bonuses as you described without changing humans at all. I doubt it will cause problems. If your friends are making non-optimized PCs, then I can't see them abusing this. Humans don't need any change because they are easy to optimize for any class.

Out of the dozen or so characters that have been made for my games since I instituted this rule, I've had two or three humans. Make of that what you will, but so far it's all balanced out for us.

Remember that not all races need a fix just because their ability scores APPEAR non optimal for their class. Your dwarf fighter gets a feat that lets him gain proficiency and +2 damage with any hammer, making up for his low strength score.

This is a good point, which is why I play race modding by ear. For example if the dwarf player switches from +2 Wis to +2 Str, I ban him from taking Dwarven Weapon Training. I'll also give him +1 to Ref or Will to make up for him doubling up on the two Fort stats.

 

[Pale Jackal]

If it wasn't mentioned already, keeping the racial stats as is but giving all races a +2 to a stat of their choice while reducing point-buy to 20 keeps overall stats the same, while allowing Elf Warlocks.

As noted, a Str/Wis. dwarf with Dwarven Weapon Training is something to keep an eye out for.

 

[Kzach]

If it wasn't mentioned already, keeping the racial stats as is but giving all races a +2 to a stat of their choice while reducing point-buy to 20 keeps overall stats the same, while allowing Elf Warlocks.

Why make it complex?

Replacing all racial stat bonuses with two floating +2 bonuses (no more than one per stat) is easy and simple and amounts to the same thing.

As noted, a Str/Wis. dwarf with Dwarven Weapon Training is something to keep an eye out for.

Honestly, so what? What's the big deal about a dwarf with a couple of nice benefits? It's not so unbalancing as to make them invincible or even all that special. It's just an occasional damage bonus and makes them really sticky fighters... have more enemies hit them and problem solved. Everything evens out somewhere, somehow.

If there's a particular corner case where they're so broken as to ruin the enjoyment of the game, then the group should deal with that as an individual issue.

And if you can't deal with it fairly and reasonably as a mature group of adults, then is it really a group you want to be playing with anyway?