ranger powers and heavy thrown weapons

[mattdm]

It's kinda disappointing to me that all of the ranger powers preclude making effective use of heavy thrown weapons. It's kind of odd, actually — it's not like the powers in question always only work with Dex: if you're using a melee weapon they use Str instead.

It seems like an oversight that they don't include heavy thrown weapons as using Str for these powers. If you read the section on "Strength or Dexterity" on page 216, the RAW is very clear that whatever the power says goes, and the description for Heavy Thrown specifically says it applies to ranged basic attacks only.

I'd be inclined to house rule that any power which lets you use Str for melee and Dex for ranged also lets you use Str for heavy thrown; what do you think?

 

[Otterscrubber]

Sounds fair to me.

 

[Palladion]

Be aware that this change allows a ranger to completely disregard Dex and still remain competitively effective with both ranged and melee powers. However, the change is not unreasonable and if it works in the context of your game, should not be disregarded.

 

[Zurai]

Note that heavy thrown weapons don't do as much damage as bows and have far less range. Using heavy thrown instead of bows is already sub-optimal. Giving them the benefit of being able to use their melee powers without dropping their bow and Quickdrawing two weapons is the silver lining. Especially when, as an archer ranger, you can generally just shift away and attack with impunity.

I'd say it's balanced.

 

[djdaidouji]

I like to follow "It may not make sense, but they tell us it's balanced" train of thought.
To make it logical, the ranger's ranged powers require more accuracy then anything to pull off. For example, Nimble Strike, you're concentrating on shifting while attacking, so you can't put your full strength into it, so the best you can do is be super accurate. Strength deals damage through force, Dexterity deals damage by being precise.

Saying this, I think you should go ahead and use Strength if you want. Javelins are pretty expensive, so the it counters the balancing issues in a way.

 

[Aria Silverhands]

Regardless of balance or whether or not it makes sense... it just looks cool. A ranger fighting with two throwing axes, and tossing one while slashing with the other.

 

[mattdm]

I like to follow "It may not make sense, but they tell us it's balanced" train of thought.
To make it logical, the ranger's ranged powers require more accuracy then anything to pull off. For example, Nimble Strike, you're concentrating on shifting while attacking, so you can't put your full strength into it, so the best you can do is be super accurate. Strength deals damage through force, Dexterity deals damage by being precise.

Right, I buy this for the ranged-only powers. But what about Twin Strike, Careful Attack (ignore the issues with the math for this discussion!), Evasive Strike, Two-Fanged Strike, etc., etc.? These feats already work with strength, but specifically for melee attacks. It's almost like they just forgot to think about heavy thrown.

Meanwhile, look at Fox's Cunning — it works fine for heavy thrown weapons, since it allows you to make a basic ranged attack.

 

[theNater]

Is a ranger using dex for heavy thrown weapons at range that much stranger than a rogue using dex when using a melee weapon? Or a paladin using cha with a greataxe?

The style of the attack calls for dex at range. You can use light thrown, heavy thrown, or missile weapons, but they all call for dex when that power is used with a ranged weapon.