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Revised cleric (concept only)
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<blockquote data-quote="Hawken" data-source="post: 4514223" data-attributes="member: 23619"><p>I would limit the choices to two paths for each class and allow enough flexibility in each path for customization. Your examples of Wizard and Sorcerer illustrate this point well enough. </p><p></p><p>Healer is not a good (or fun) option for Cleric. While healing is very important, nobody wants to be the walking, breathing band-aid for the group. It also seems kind of hypocritical for a 'healer', someone devoted to treating injuries and relieving suffering, to have competent combat abilities and being able to put people in an early grave. Combat clerics are already around; they're called Paladins. Utility and Support are pretty much the same thing and neither fit the Cleric class, but are more like those pesky 4e "roles". </p><p></p><p>Clerics are stewards of souls, servants of gods, etc., etc.,. While they may take a secondary place in group (combat) dynamics, their goals are always going to be of primary concern. Support/Utility roles mean the Cleric is placing the will of his deity second to a mortal's ambitions and goals and it also implies that the powers granted by the deity are not enough for the Cleric to get the job done.</p><p></p><p>I would suggest the Cloistered Cleric and the "regular" Cleric as path choices. Although, I'd change the Cloistered name, maybe a different religious title like Minister or even just Priest, much for the same reason and hypothetical discussion I gave for non-specialized Wizards. </p><p></p><p>So, using the Priest (in place of Cloistered Cleric) and Cleric, here is a suggestion for differences.</p><p></p><p>Priest: </p><p>BAB: 1/2</p><p>Saves: Will Good, Fort/Ref Poor.</p><p>HD: D4</p><p>Armor: None </p><p>Weapons: Simple.</p><p></p><p>Cleric: </p><p>BAB: 3/4</p><p>Saves: Fort/Will Good, Ref Poor.</p><p>HD: D8</p><p>Armor: Light, shields.</p><p>Weapons: Simple, Favored Weapons.</p><p></p><p>Priest Special Abilities:</p><p>Defense: Priests gain a Divine bonus to AC equal to their Wisdom modifier. This power operates as the Monk ability. </p><p>Domains: Priests begin with two Domains, like Clerics. They gain the regular Domain powers, but get to cast EACH of their domain spells each day, rather than choosing one Domain spell of each spell level. At 5th, 10th, 15th, and 20th, Priests learn a new Domain of their deity's portfolio, until they have learned a maximum number of domains equal to their Wisdom modifier.</p><p>Vow of Service: Priests gain the benefits of the Vow of Poverty feat. The benefits of this ability do NOT stack or work in conjunction with any powers from magic items. </p><p>Consecrated Turning: Priests in the area of a Consecrate spell or on the grounds of any temple, church, or shrine always Turn at their Priest level or higher, even if their Turn check indicates they would Turn at a lower level. Priests may Turn normally or as a full round action and gain a +3 bonus to their Turn check and the Turn damage. </p><p></p><p>Cleric Special Abilities:</p><p>As per PHB, except where different here:</p><p>Domains: Clerics begin with one Domain. They get access to the Domain ability, but do not get an extra spell slot of each level for Domain spells. Instead, they can Spontaneously convert any spell to a Cure spell or their Domain spell. </p><p>Second Domain: At 10th level, Clerics gain access to a second Domain, gaining its special ability. Clerics gain an extra spell of each spell level they can cast and this spell must be selected from one of their Domains. Clerics can still spontaneously cast any Cure or Domain spell from their prepared spells.</p><p>Martial Training: At 3rd level, Clerics do not gain any spellcasting abilities and instead choose one of the following:</p><p>** Learn the Medium Armor proficiency feat and Dodge feat.</p><p>** Gain Weapon Focus with the deity's Favored Weapon. </p><p>Martial Training: At 8th level, Clerics do not gain any spellcasting abilities and instead choose one of the following:</p><p>** Learn the Heavy Armor proficiency feat and the Mobility feat.</p><p>** Gain Weapon Specialization with the deity's Favored Weapon.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Hawken, post: 4514223, member: 23619"] I would limit the choices to two paths for each class and allow enough flexibility in each path for customization. Your examples of Wizard and Sorcerer illustrate this point well enough. Healer is not a good (or fun) option for Cleric. While healing is very important, nobody wants to be the walking, breathing band-aid for the group. It also seems kind of hypocritical for a 'healer', someone devoted to treating injuries and relieving suffering, to have competent combat abilities and being able to put people in an early grave. Combat clerics are already around; they're called Paladins. Utility and Support are pretty much the same thing and neither fit the Cleric class, but are more like those pesky 4e "roles". Clerics are stewards of souls, servants of gods, etc., etc.,. While they may take a secondary place in group (combat) dynamics, their goals are always going to be of primary concern. Support/Utility roles mean the Cleric is placing the will of his deity second to a mortal's ambitions and goals and it also implies that the powers granted by the deity are not enough for the Cleric to get the job done. I would suggest the Cloistered Cleric and the "regular" Cleric as path choices. Although, I'd change the Cloistered name, maybe a different religious title like Minister or even just Priest, much for the same reason and hypothetical discussion I gave for non-specialized Wizards. So, using the Priest (in place of Cloistered Cleric) and Cleric, here is a suggestion for differences. Priest: BAB: 1/2 Saves: Will Good, Fort/Ref Poor. HD: D4 Armor: None Weapons: Simple. Cleric: BAB: 3/4 Saves: Fort/Will Good, Ref Poor. HD: D8 Armor: Light, shields. Weapons: Simple, Favored Weapons. Priest Special Abilities: Defense: Priests gain a Divine bonus to AC equal to their Wisdom modifier. This power operates as the Monk ability. Domains: Priests begin with two Domains, like Clerics. They gain the regular Domain powers, but get to cast EACH of their domain spells each day, rather than choosing one Domain spell of each spell level. At 5th, 10th, 15th, and 20th, Priests learn a new Domain of their deity's portfolio, until they have learned a maximum number of domains equal to their Wisdom modifier. Vow of Service: Priests gain the benefits of the Vow of Poverty feat. The benefits of this ability do NOT stack or work in conjunction with any powers from magic items. Consecrated Turning: Priests in the area of a Consecrate spell or on the grounds of any temple, church, or shrine always Turn at their Priest level or higher, even if their Turn check indicates they would Turn at a lower level. Priests may Turn normally or as a full round action and gain a +3 bonus to their Turn check and the Turn damage. Cleric Special Abilities: As per PHB, except where different here: Domains: Clerics begin with one Domain. They get access to the Domain ability, but do not get an extra spell slot of each level for Domain spells. Instead, they can Spontaneously convert any spell to a Cure spell or their Domain spell. Second Domain: At 10th level, Clerics gain access to a second Domain, gaining its special ability. Clerics gain an extra spell of each spell level they can cast and this spell must be selected from one of their Domains. Clerics can still spontaneously cast any Cure or Domain spell from their prepared spells. Martial Training: At 3rd level, Clerics do not gain any spellcasting abilities and instead choose one of the following: ** Learn the Medium Armor proficiency feat and Dodge feat. ** Gain Weapon Focus with the deity's Favored Weapon. Martial Training: At 8th level, Clerics do not gain any spellcasting abilities and instead choose one of the following: ** Learn the Heavy Armor proficiency feat and the Mobility feat. ** Gain Weapon Specialization with the deity's Favored Weapon. [/QUOTE]
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