D&D 5E Running "The Lost Mines of Phandelver"

[Xeviat]

Hi everyone. My brother and sister wanted to play D&D, but we live states away, so we're going to be using Roll20. Our SO's are going to be joining in too, so there's me and 5 players. I haven't run Lost Mines before, so I'm looking forward a bit.

I'm noticing that the first leg of the adventure seems a little brutal for 4 characters. I was looking to add a little extra since we'll have 5 players, but now I'm not sure. The goblin caves looks like they really need to be done with a long rest somewhere in the middle, but I cannot imagine them being able to walk out and come back, or rest in the caves, you know?

This adventure won awards, so people clearly played it and liked it.

What have been your experiences with it?

 

[Croesus]

You're not wrong to be concerned about Cragmaw Hideout - it's one of the deadliest areas in the adventure, precisely because the characters are low level when they encounter it. My own group were defeated and captured by Klarg and his goblins. They had to come up with a scheme to offer to bring back treasure if he let one of them go get it, then later got away and came back more prepared. You don't need to beef it up for five PCs.

1) Counting the four goblins the party encounters on the Triboar Trail, there are 18 goblins, 4 wolves, and a bugbear using the caves. Make sure if/when the party follow the tracks that they realize there are a lot of goblins and they should be careful in approaching the area.

2) Near the cave, the two goblin guards are not paying much attention. If they do spot the party, two goblins shouldn't want to start a fight with so many adventurers, so they should try to sneak away. Be sure to check their stealth rolls against the party passive perceptions. Maybe the party see them sneak back into the cave.

3) I ran the goblins as very disorganized and cowardly unless Klarg was right there to push them. So if the initial foray into the cave goes badly, the goblins will likely let the party run away, just peppering them with arrows. Likewise, they would be likely to run away from fights that aren't going their way. If the party does flee, maybe they can get far enough away to rest before returning, especially a short rest, as it will take Klarg a bit of time to figure out what happened and decide what to do about it.

4) If these are new players, consider giving hints, like pointing out the wolves in area 3 are hungry, or that wolves don't usually attack armed parties without reason (perhaps a survival check). This may prompt a player into realizing that this fight can be avoided.

5) If worse comes to worst, have Klarg capture the PCs, intending to trade them to the Black Spider for payment. Then the players can attempt to negotiate and/or escape.

Once they survive Klarg, things get quite a bit easier for the PCs.

 

[happyhermit]

This adventure won awards, so people clearly played it and liked it.
What have been your experiences with it?

Ran it many times, watched/listened to it being run many more, it is a fantastic adventure when using the pre-gens or including their hooks and backgrounds into the PCs, it is still a good adventure otherwise IMO.

... The goblin caves looks like they really need to be done with a long rest somewhere in the middle, but I cannot imagine them being able to walk out and come back, or rest in the caves, you know?

What? No. I have run a group of 3 completely new-to-ttrpg players through this and they were fine without me "going easy on them" to any degree. Sometimes the party goes to town first, particularly without the close ties to the NPCs that are intended, so they get a long rest between ambush and caves but that is all. When run as written the adventure is pretty much dead on to the intended # of encounters per day that PCs are designed to handle (when counting traps especially).

 

[Ath-kethin]

I second the "don't worry about it" approach.

I played in a 2-player (+1 the DM) game and we got through it fine. The DM wanted to add a DMPC to the group but the other player and I rebelled. There was no need.

 

[ArwensDaughter]

I've DM'd most of it. I wouldn't up foes. Some encounters were close to deadly; I fudged a few roles. If you are using the pregens, be sure that you as DM read all the backstory info. With the rogue pregen in particular you will need to do some thinking about how to handle certain encounters, and should talk that over with that player one on one.

It is a great starter adventure. Have fun!

 

[Imaculata]

I noticed that when I played it, the first part with the goblins is way too combat heavy if you have a small party. And if you also lack a dedicated healer, then you'll be constantly resting after every fight. At level 1, it was a grind, with several players nearly dying at every fight. I personally think the adventure is just fine even if the DM cuts out a few combat encounters.

Why are many of these campaigns so combat heavy anyway? This is a roleplaying game is it not? And not some straight up medieval combat simulator? I wish they would include more none combat encounters... and exploration. There does not have to be a fight after every corner and in every room. Rooms in dungeons CAN be meaningful if they do not have combat in them.

 

[Immoralkickass]

I noticed that when I played it, the first part with the goblins is way too combat heavy if you have a small party. And if you also lack a dedicated healer, then you'll be constantly resting after every fight. At level 1, it was a grind, with several players nearly dying at every fight. I personally think the adventure is just fine even if the DM cuts out a few combat encounters.

Why are many of these campaigns so combat heavy anyway? This is a roleplaying game is it not? And not some straight up medieval combat simulator? I wish they would include more none combat encounters... and exploration. There does not have to be a fight after every corner and in every room. Rooms in dungeons CAN be meaningful if they do not have combat in them.

I think LMoP is meant to be the classic feel of DnD, a standard party (standard race/class combo) fighting classic DnD enemies like goblins and bugbears, being typical heroes and not much else. Just because its an RPG doesnt mean combat has to be easy, otherwise there won't be the feeling of accomplishment and heroism. Also, that is precisely why they had to ask help from adventurers, otherwise Gundren could just get a few men from Phandalin and do it themselves. And yes, the module was meant for a party of 5. Anything else than that, your party will really suffer. You really shouldn't expect victory to be spoonfed to you, or the world to mollycoddle your candy ass. After all, if you think Cragmaw Castle is hard, wait till you go to Thundertree.

But its quite true that the opportunities for RP is few, and as a video gamer myself, it tends to feel a bit 'video gamey'. After defeating goblin #157 and finding yet another chest filled with gold, potions and gemstones in it, I'm starting to see a pattern here...

 

[Imaculata]

I think LMoP is meant to be the classic feel of DnD, a standard party (standard race/class combo) fighting classic DnD enemies like goblins and bugbears, being typical heroes and not much else.

And I can get totally behind that. But D&D has changed a lot over the years (for the better). Adventures no longer have to be these repetitive grinds, with room after room filled with goblins.

Just because its an RPG doesnt mean combat has to be easy,

I think there's some middle ground between a fight being easy, and the party being at death's doorstep.

otherwise there won't be the feeling of accomplishment and heroism.

I don't think that's true at all. My players have had some fights that were very easy, yet gave them a great sense of acomplishment and heroism.

You really shouldn't expect victory to be spoonfed to you, or the world to mollycoddle your candy ass.

At level 1, as you are barely learning how to play the game, with probably new players, a new DM, and a beginner campaign?

 

[Immoralkickass]

And I can get totally behind that. But D&D has changed a lot over the years (for the better). Adventures no longer have to be these repetitive grinds, with room after room filled with goblins.



I think there's some middle ground between a fight being easy, and the party being at death's doorstep.



I don't think that's true at all. My players have had some fights that were very easy, yet gave them a great sense of acomplishment and heroism.



At level 1, as you are barely learning how to play the game, with probably new players, a new DM, and a beginner campaign?

And its up to the DM to adjust that accordingly. The DM have many ways to make it easier for inexperienced players:

1. Open up the race/class options to all the options in the PHB, or better yet, allow UA, SCAG, EE and other books.
2. Encourage them to optimize their characters, and give them tips on how to do so
3. Make sure each role in the party is covered, with as few overlapping of roles or same classes as possible.
4. Give them inspiration each session, so they won't be afraid to waste it, or save it and never use it. Tell them they can use the inspiration to get hints if they are unsure about stuff, such as 'is it a wise move to storm Cragmaw in our current condition?'
5. Make interesting situations. For example, goblins are cowardly, so when most of them start dropping, make the surviving few beg for mercy in exchange for information. This is the time to test your players alignment too lol.

Obviously, the DM needs to be at least an experienced player for this.

 

[Imaculata]

I agree on pretty much all those points @Immoral, but I think the DM should also not be afraid to simply leave out some battles, if the party seems to be struggling too much with the enemies. This is a beginners campaign, for level 1 characters. So the fights should be relatively easy. If the players struggle regardless, tone down the number of enemies.