Science Fiction Setting

[Wednesday Boy]

The original trilogy through Thrawn Trilogy Star Wars. I've always wanted to play in the Firefly and Star Trek settings but have never actually done it.

 

[Hand of Evil]

Star Wars for its playability, it has a lot going for it.

 

[Super Pony]

Eclipse Phase = my favorite hardish sci-fi transhuman setting.
Star Wars = it's pretty much part of my DNA at this point.
Warhammer 40k = it's such a gloomy kitbash of so many other settings. Rather than it being a deal breaker, it just makes me a happy camper. I'm also a fan of the tidbits unique to the franchise...even in spite of GW
Numenera = a bit premature perhaps, but I'm still diggin' on it so nyah

 

[Derren]

Not a Traveller-player. I may have read through the game once, many years ago? But, in general, I don't feel the form of the body is what differentiates fantasy from science fiction. Ultimately, the breaks between fantasy and science fiction aren't so my about what happens, by why it happens, and what the story is attempting to explore.



Like this - no, psionics are not equivalent to magic. Some of the results are the same, but the operating principles differ. The base issue is this: The fundamental principles behind the powers in science fiction are generally scientific - rational, if inaccurate. The fundamental principles behind magic are irrational. Or, to put it in the language of science: If the operating principles are falsifiable, at least in theory, it is science fiction. If they are non-falsifiable, then it is fantasy.

So why exactly do you consider Shadowrun to be fantasy then? The theme is Dystopian with huge megacorporations waging a shadow war for stock prices and market shares and magic is scientific (mages are well paid employees, there is the MIT&T, Massachusetts Institute of Technology & Thaumaturgy, and people are working on a Unified Magical Theorem). Classic fantasy races exist but they are completely un-fantasy like integrated into the modern world. Your neighbor could be an orc and there are several groups fighting for equality for ghouls for example.

 

[Umbran]

So why exactly do you consider Shadowrun to be fantasy then?

What I said was that I had a hard time trying to think of it as science fiction.

The theme is Dystopian with huge megacorporations waging a shadow war for stock prices and market shares and magic is scientific

Except, of course, for all those shamans. And how you could describe the hermetic tradition as not so much scientific as systematized - there is a difference.

But, ultimately, it comes down to the Rod Serling quote: Fantasy is the impossible made probable. That's pretty much what you've got when major plotlines included insect spirits taking over Chicago and a dragon becoming President. While megacorps exist, the major threats always seem to wind up to be supernatural, both in the published adventures and the fiction (at least, back when I was playing).

John W. Campbell. 1947. "To be science fiction, not fantasy, an honest effort at prophetic extrapolation from the known must be made." - Shadowrun fails when it includes the return of magic, which is in no way an extrapolation from the known.

Theodore Sturgeon. 1952. "A science fiction story is a story built around human beings, with a human problem, and a human solution, which would not have happened at all without its scientific content." - many of the problems and solutions in Shadowrun are spiritual, not scientific.

We could go on. I'm not trying to convince you. I'm merely elucidating my own thoughts. Shadowrun is no more science fiction than, say, Deadlands. The basic concept of both games are, "let us take this society, add magic, and see what happens". That makes it fundamentally a fantasy story, as it is the reaction to magic that makes it what it is.

 

[Derren]

Except, of course, for all those shamans. And how you could describe the hermetic tradition as not so much scientific as systematized - there is a difference.

So if those Shamans would be called Psionics everything would be fine.
And the return of magic is pretty much as possible as most of what you have in Star Trek or other Science Fiction settings. Some technobabble doesn't change that in most Science Fiction you are in the end dealing with magic.

 

[Umbran]

So if those Shamans would be called Psionics everything would be fine.

No. You keep missing the meat of the issue. What hey are *called* isn't the issue. The operating principles, and how those principles impact the fiction, is what matters.

And the return of magic is pretty much as possible as most of what you have in Star Trek or other Science Fiction settings.

Yeah. Sure...

http://www.nasa.gov/centers/glenn/technology/warp/warpstat_prt.htm

Things like transporters and warp drives are extrapolations from current scientific principles - they may turn out to be inaccurate extrapolations, or extrapolations very far ahead, but they are still starting from current understanding of how the universe actually works, and taking it forward in a logical manner. Shaking a rattle and grinding up newt's eyeballs to summon a spirit isn't.

 

[Gryph]

Put me down for the Firefly 'verse. For what its worth I agree with most of Umbran's reasoning about the difference between Science Fiction and Science Fantasy which is why I don't consider Star Wars or Shadowrun science fiction.

 

[Richards]

Gamma World for me.

Johnathan

 

[GhostShip Blue]

Setting only, in order:
7: 40K: Kill! Kill! Kill! While we all wait for it to be just the 'Crons chasing the 'Nids...
6: BattleTech/Mech Warrior. 40K without badly explained elves and orcs and disappearing dwarves.
5: CthulhuTech. Lovecraft with hints of 40K and Eclipse Phase. And Mechs - schweet!
4: Ringworld: Kzin. Pierson's Puppeteers. Ringworld.
3: Eclipse Phase. Smart, cool, thought provoking.
2: Gamma World/Metamorphosis Alpha. This is where SF roleplaying began for me.
1: Living Steel. Power Armor. Knights Errant. Lost technology and heroes out of time. Some of this sounding familiar?