Semi-Virtual Table Top: Please Help With A Decision

[Filthy Lucre]

Hello En World Brain Trust™,

I am hoping that I can rely on your collective insight to solve a problem. I really love D&D maps - and we are certainly experiencing a renaissance of amazing maps as cartographers churn out tons of great maps for battles, cities, and whole worlds. However, with the coolness of maps comes the complication of displaying them. Not only is printing maps fairly expensive, but for a certain size of maps it becomes practically impossible. (I work for a commercial printer and there are limits even for us whether practical or economical).

My solution is going to be upgrading my table with a 55" touch screen display that I will use to display my maps. This is what I meant by a "semi-virtual" tabletop.

Even though I only "need" it for display purposes, I know there are now lots of players in the VTT scene. There are some functions and features I don't need, (since our group meets in person), but there are others that would even further enhance our experience - like being able to obscure/hide unexplored areas of a dungeon. I also wouldn't mind being able to more easily display/track conditions.

Given this situation, what VTTs would the En World Brain Trust™ suggest?

 

[Ryujin]

I believe that both Roll20 and Fantasy Grounds Unity have "fog of war" and "dynamic lighting." Both can make for some rather interesting gaming. I've played in VTTs that used these features and it's pretty interesting when you've got characters with 60' Infravision and others with regular vision, and just a lantern, and how what they are able to see differs. Of course you can't quite do that on a single display, but just being able to limit players to what their characters can actually see from the party's vantage point(s) is plenty interesting. You only know where that creature WAS before it ran around the corner. Not where it IS.

 

[UngainlyTitan]

FantasyGrounds has very good initiative and condition tracking. Particularly if you are not using the automation. You can enter conditions directly in to the Combat tracker and give them a duration in rounds and an initiative to decrement the rounds.

 

[turnip_farmer]

I believe that both Roll20 and Fantasy Grounds Unity have "fog of war" and "dynamic lighting." Both can make for some rather interesting gaming. I've played in VTTs that used these features and it's pretty interesting when you've got characters with 60' Infravision and others with regular vision, and just a lantern, and how what they are able to see differs. Of course you can't quite do that on a single display, but just being able to limit players to what their characters can actually see from the party's vantage point(s) is plenty interesting. You only know where that creature WAS before it ran around the corner. Not where it IS.

On something like Roll20, if you have the visions of all the tokens set differently, you can switch the shared monitor view between them as each player takes their turn.

It won't change the fact that Dave already saw what the elf could see on the previous turn, but it will help him understand what Ragnomar the Fighter is supposed to be able to see. I guess it's a style question whether that matters or helps.

 

[Filthy Lucre]

On something like Roll20, if you have the visions of all the tokens set differently, you can switch the shared monitor view between them as each player takes their turn.

It won't change the fact that Dave already saw what the elf could see on the previous turn, but it will help him understand what Ragnomar the Fighter is supposed to be able to see. I guess it's a style question whether that matters or helps.

One worry I have is if the number of "screens"/instances relates to the number of player tokens that are allotted. For example, normally with a VTT the DM has a computer, and then 4 other people each have a computer. Is the program going to care that 4 people are sharing one instance?

 

[turnip_farmer]

One worry I have is if the number of "screens"/instances relates to the number of player tokens that are allotted. For example, normally with a VTT the DM has a computer, and then 4 other people each have a computer. Is the program going to care that 4 people are sharing one instance?

They don't need to,. Using Roll20 as an example, if (as the GM) you hit ctrl+l while selecting a token, it will show you what the player controlling that token will see.

The only issue I can see is if you want things on the map to be hidden to all players. Switching between player views is easy unless Player A can't see Player B. Then you will need to temporarily reveal the entire map to find player B's token.

If this would be an issue, then it might help to have a second device (like a laptop) which only the GM can see. The shared tabletop would be logged in as a player account, but you give that account control and vision for all player tokens. Anything that needs to be hidden can be placed onto the GM layer until it is needed, and then you only need to use the laptop to move things onto the appropriate layer as it comes up.

 

[Filthy Lucre]

They don't need to,. Using Roll20 as an example, if (as the GM) you hit ctrl+l while selecting a token, it will show you what the player controlling that token will see.

The only issue I can see is if you want things on the map to be hidden to all players. Switching between player views is easy unless Player A can't see Player B. Then you will need to temporarily reveal the entire map to find player B's token.

If this would be an issue, then it might help to have a second device (like a laptop) which only the GM can see. The shared tabletop would be logged in as a player account, but you give that account control and vision for all player tokens. Anything that needs to be hidden can be placed onto the GM layer until it is needed, and then you only need to use the laptop to move things onto the appropriate layer as it comes up.

Ah, yes, should have made that explicit: I'll have my laptop behind my DM screen so technically there would be two instances, (DM + Players).

 

[UngainlyTitan]

II would not think so but with dynamic lighting in effect I would expect that the players would only see what is the LOS of the selected player. So perhaps switching off dynamic lighting and using just fog of war might be better.

 

[ninjayeti]

Owlbear Rodeo is a free, barebones VTT that supports uploading custom maps and tokens. It has a fog of war feature to hide unexplored parts of the map, but it needs to be adjusted manually, rather than supporting "dynamic lighting" that changes as tokens are moved. It supports some condition tracking via adding colored rings onto tokens (e.g. green means poisoned, yellow means restrained, etc.). If you are just going to be using the VTT as a map tool, it may be a good choice for you as it is not cluttered up with features you are not going to use. Here is a video of someone using a local setup like you are describing.

Roll20 is a "freemium" full featured VTT. It can do all of the above with a free account. It is also a bit better at tracking conditions as there is more built-in support for adding numbers or icons to a token. If you pay for the subscription it also supports "dynamic lighting" which automatically changes the fog of war to reflect what a token can see. While this is cool, much of the effect may be lost if the players are all looking at the same screen. It is also a bit of work up front to set up because you need to mark all the walls and doors on the map so it knows what blocks LoS.

Fantasy Grounds does all of the above, plus can track condition durations if you are using the initiative tracker. However, I believe you would need to pay for two copies to run the setup you are describing, so probably not the best option for you.

Owlbear Rodeo and Roll20 are both free so I would encourage you to give them a test drive. I am guessing you can find some online demos of dynamic lighting so you can get an idea of whether or not it is something you are going to want to use. Good luck!

 

[UngainlyTitan]

Owlbear Rodeo is a free, barebones VTT that supports uploading custom maps and tokens. It has a fog of war feature to hide unexplored parts of the map, but it needs to be adjusted manually, rather than supporting "dynamic lighting" that changes as tokens are moved. It supports some condition tracking via adding colored rings onto tokens (e.g. green means poisoned, yellow means restrained, etc.). If you are just going to be using the VTT as a map tool, it may be a good choice for you as it is not cluttered up with features you are not going to use. Here is a video of someone using a local setup like you are describing.

Roll20 is a "freemium" full featured VTT. It can do all of the above with a free account. It is also a bit better at tracking conditions as there is more built-in support for adding numbers or icons to a token. If you pay for the subscription it also supports "dynamic lighting" which automatically changes the fog of war to reflect what a token can see. While this is cool, much of the effect may be lost if the players are all looking at the same screen. It is also a bit of work up front to set up because you need to mark all the walls and doors on the map so it knows what blocks LoS.

Fantasy Grounds does all of the above, plus can track condition durations if you are using the initiative tracker. However, I believe you would need to pay for two copies to run the setup you are describing, so probably not the best option for you.

Owlbear Rodeo and Roll20 are both free so I would encourage you to give them a test drive. I am guessing you can find some online demos of dynamic lighting so you can get an idea of whether or not it is something you are going to want to use. Good luck!

No need to pay for two copies in the suggested configuration as one free copy can connect to a standard licenced host.