Shade Race from Dragon #307...ECL +2!?!

[treefrog]

For the record the Wilora has a CHALLENGE RATING of 2, NOT a ECL of 2. They are not the same thing.

Oh I did not read the magazine just the post. CR is indeed different.

 

[Storm Raven]

For the record the Wilora has a CHALLENGE RATING of 2, NOT a ECL of 2. They are not the same thing.

Actually, it has an ECL of 2 as well. Check page 30 of the issue, bottom of the sidebar.

 

[Storm Raven]

It has
2 natural armor
+10 to Dex,
+ 10 to Int
+ 10 to Cha
+ 8 to Wia
- 6 to str.
That is seriously wrong as a ECL 2
If you don't like the low dc special abilities you don't have to use them and you are still way way way ahead of the game. You don't have to look at the polymorph as useless during the day with these stat bonuses you can think of it as a useful bonus at night.

The point is that while it may be wrong as an ECL of 2, it doesn't the same benefits that it was asserted to have. That is the point, it may be incorrectly set up, but it is not what it was reported to be.

 

[Quixon]

Actually, it has an ECL of 2 as well. Check page 30 of the issue, bottom of the sidebar.

You are semi-correct, I read the creature description and never saw that little block on page 30. But that has a Level Adjustment mod, not ECL modifier.

This would make the Wilora a ECL of +4 would it not? Level adjustment plus the Base HD equals ECL and Wilora has 2HD........
2 + Wiloras 2HD= +4 ECL.

 

[Arcturus_Rugend]

Not to hijack the thread, but as a Non-Dragon subscriber, what the heck IS a wilora? Just curious.

 

[Quixon]

Not to hijack the thread, but as a Non-Dragon subscriber, what the heck IS a wilora? Just curious.

Its a funky Bird race rumored to be mixed with the blood/ancestry of a Doppleganger lol.

 

[Sollir Furryfoot]

Sorry about the +5, I was looking at the dex bonus accidentally.

Anyhow, AFAIK, Dragon Magazine does not factor in Savage Species rules to any of their monster articles. If they *did*, they would have some seriously screwed up ECLs from their previous magazines, for example: the creator race in a previous Neverwinter Nights article would be somewhere around total ECL 16.

Even if they do come with 2 HD, they have a crazy number of (bonus?) feats (6 in fact-Alertness, Dodge, Improved Initiative, Iron Will, Lightning Reflexes, Mobility). Also an additional +4 bonus on saves vs. enchantment spells.

 

[kreynolds]

Figured I would give this thread one more shot. Anybody else have any additional input on this? I'd could use some fresh perspectives.

 

[Madfox]

But, I do get what you're saying. However, the problem is this; while having a 26 strength at 6th level is awfully powerful, and quite deserving of an ECL modifier, a 26 strength at 20th level is about the norm, so an ECL modifier is no longer warranted. Its just like having spell resistance of a static amount.

Except that that same character with a strenght of 26 at level 6 would either have a strenght of [the norm of lvl 20] + 26 or would have used those resources to get something else equally nifty.

As for comparing a boost of an attribute as a racial modifier to the ones through leveling, that is also flawed. With the racial modifier you gain the benefit for the first 8th levels, not to mention that you could boost your own score by two more or place them in secundary attributes like for example constitution.

When talking about balance, one should always assume the worst case scenario and judge the ECL when applied to the most beneficial class/race combination.

 

[kreynolds]

Except that that same character with a strenght of 26 at level 6 would either have a strenght of [the norm of lvl 20] + 26 or would have used those resources to get something else equally nifty.

This was already pointed out by drnuncheon on the first page. Please, at least give me the courtesy of reading the thread before you jump in.