Shadow Dancer powers

[Zaruthustran]

Shadow Dancers sound neat but I'm not sure how their powers work.

1: Summon Shadow

Summon Shadow (Su): At 3rd level, a shadowdancer can summon a shadow, an undead shade. Unlike a normal shadow, this shadow’s alignment matches that of the shadowdancer, and the creature cannot create spawn. The summoned shadow cannot be turned, rebuked, or commanded by any third party. This shadow serves as a companion to the shadowdancer and can communicate intelligibly with the shadowdancer. Every third level gained by the shadowdancer adds +2 HD (and the requisite base attack and base save bonus increases) to her shadow companion.

This power is listed at 3rd level, and also at 6th and 9th.

So... does the Shadow Companion of a 3rd level Shadow Dancer have +2HD?

I'm thinking yes, from "Every third level gained by the shadowdancer adds +2 HD" and the fact that a shadow has 19 hit points--not nearly enough to hang with a minimum 10th level character. But I can see an argument that "every third level" actually means "every third level after level 3".

2: Hide in Plain Sight

Hide in Plain Sight (Su): A shadowdancer can use the Hide skill even while being observed. As long as she is within 10 feet of some sort of shadow, a shadowdancer can hide herself from view in the open without anything to actually hide behind. She cannot, however, hide in her own shadow.
HIDE (DEX; ARMOR CHECK PENALTY)
Check: Your Hide check is opposed by the Spot check of anyone who might see you. If people are observing you, even casually, you can’t hide. A 13th-level ranger can attempt a Hide check in any sort of natural terrain, even if it doesn’t grant cover or concealment. A 17th-level ranger can do this even while being observed.

A 17th level ranger has Hide in Plain Sight.

HiPS gets rid of the "If people are observing you, you can't hide" rule, allowing you to make Hide checks while being observed. The check is a straight Hide roll opposed by the Spot of anyone who might see you.

This is all clear to me, but I've seen some people mention a penalty to HiPS. Where does this penalty come from?

-z, looking for clarity

 

[Particle_Man]

Shadow Dancers sound neat but I'm not sure how their powers work.

1: Summon Shadow



This power is listed at 3rd level, and also at 6th and 9th.

So... does the Shadow Companion of a 3rd level Shadow Dancer have +2HD?

I'm thinking yes, from "Every third level gained by the shadowdancer adds +2 HD" and the fact that a shadow has 19 hit points--not nearly enough to hang with a minimum 10th level character. But I can see an argument that "every third level" actually means "every third level after level 3".


-z, looking for clarity

Given that the text says a 9th level shadowdancer has a shadow companion of 6 HD, your interpretation seems to be false. Note that as written, that seems to be a typo, as shadows have 3 Hd (not 2 HD) in 3rd ed, so a 9th level shadow dancer should have a 7 HD shadow. On your interpreation that would be a 10 HD shadow, which is more powerful than the mightiest of shadows (they only advance to 9HD).

I personally would houserule that a shadowdancer gets a 3 HD shadow at 3rd, a bump up to 6 HD at 6th (and the extra 6 HD shadow) and a bump up to 9 HD (max for shadows) at 9th (and the extra 9HD shadow) but that is just me.

 

[Zaruthustran]

Given that the text says a 9th level shadowdancer has a shadow companion of 6 HD, your interpretation seems to be false. Note that as written, that seems to be a typo, as shadows have 3 Hd (not 2 HD) in 3rd ed, so a 9th level shadow dancer should have a 7 HD shadow. On your interpreation that would be a 10 HD shadow, which is more powerful than the mightiest of shadows (they only advance to 9HD).

I personally would houserule that a shadowdancer gets a 3 HD shadow at 3rd, a bump up to 6 HD at 6th (and the extra 6 HD shadow) and a bump up to 9 HD (max for shadows) at 9th (and the extra 9HD shadow) but that is just me.

Doh - good point about the 6HD thing. Teaches me to go off the SRD alone.

-z

 

[Dark Jezter]

2: Hide in Plain Sight

A 17th level ranger has Hide in Plain Sight.

HiPS gets rid of the "If people are observing you, you can't hide" rule, allowing you to make Hide checks while being observed. The check is a straight Hide roll opposed by the Spot of anyone who might see you.

This is all clear to me, but I've seen some people mention a penalty to HiPS. Where does this penalty come from?

-z, looking for clarity

Rangers can only HiPS in natural surroundings. A shadowdancer can HiPS anywhere, including wilderness areas, dungeons, and urban settings. Perhaps the ranger's "natural settings only" restriction was the drawback you were thinking of?

 

[Mal-2]

A shadowdancer can HiPS anywhere, including wilderness areas, dungeons, and urban settings.

Isn't it only anywhere within 10 feet of a shadow? That's not neccessarily the same thing, especially when dealing with creatures with darkvision, right?

Mal-2

 

[Storminator]

Rangers can only HiPS in natural surroundings. A shadowdancer can HiPS anywhere, including wilderness areas, dungeons, and urban settings. Perhaps the ranger's "natural settings only" restriction was the drawback you were thinking of?

There's a penalty for running or charging while hiding that often gets brought up, and folks talk about hiding after hitting in combat. I think those are the penalties.

PS

 

[Zaruthustran]

Isn't it only anywhere within 10 feet of a shadow? That's not neccessarily the same thing, especially when dealing with creatures with darkvision, right?

Mal-2

Darkvision doesn't destroy the existance of shadows in the world. It only negates the normal concealing effect of shadows for the person with Darkvision.

The shadowdancer's supernatural Hide In Plain Sight ability works as long as a shadow exists within 10 feet, even if a particular viewer has the ability to plainly see into that shadow.

-z