Shifter (Razorclaw): Melee weapon and claw attack inconsistency

[Methos of Aundair]

In my Eberron campaign I have a player who is playing a Shifter (Razorclaw) Ranger who just reached 2nd level. He plans on going the two-weapon combat style with a longsword and shortsword. Wanting to make sure I had everything in order in case he shifts and wishes to use a longsword in conjunction with a claw attack I have researched the rules and found conflicting rules in the ECS under Razorclaw with that of the SRD. I have quoted the relative points below.

Quoted from the SRD (TypesSubtypesAbilities)

Manufactured Weapons:
<snip>
Some creatures combine attacks with natural and manufactured weapons when they make a full attack. When they do so, the manufactured weapon attack is considered the primary attack unless the creature’s description indicates otherwise and any natural weapons the creature also uses are considered secondary natural attacks. These secondary attacks do not interfere with the primary attack as attacking with an off-hand weapon does, but they take the usual –5 penalty (or –2 with the Multiattack feat) for such attacks, even if the natural weapon used is normally the creature’s primary natural weapon.

By this our 2nd level Shifter (Razorclaw) Ranger would have a full-attack at +2 Longsword, -3 Claw.

NOTE: Using no Str modifiers for ease of simplicity.

According to the ECS (page 20) under Razorclaw it states the Shifter would attack with a melee weapon in primary hand and a claw as an off-hand weapon with all attacks at -2. This statement totally goes against that of the SRD. (Sorry, I cannot quote the ECS since it is not OGC).

By this our 2nd level Shifter (Razorclaw) Ranger would have a full-attack at +0 Longsword, +0 Claw.

Do I assume that the Shifter (Razorclaw) ruling overrides that of the SRD or was it a mistake? I see no problem with this I just find it odd since it does not follow along with that of the SRD.

Did I miss something?

Thanks

 

[Hypersmurf]

According to the ECS (page 20) under Razorclaw it states the Shifter would attack with a melee weapon in primary hand and a claw as an off-hand weapon with all attacks at -2. This statement totally goes against that of the SRD. (Sorry, I cannot quote the ECS since it is not OGC).

Does it give a reason?

Natural weapons shouldn't ever be off-hand attacks, and Improved TWF etc should never give him extra claw attacks (since they apply to off-hand attacks) - only one attack per natural weapon.

But I don't have the ECS, so I don't know if there's a reason Razorclaws are different to every other natural weapon in the game

-Hyp.

 

[Methos of Aundair]

Originally posted by Hypersmurf

Does it give a reason?

No, it doesn't. As a matter of fact I'm wondering if this was just WizCo's way of getting around the rules since basically the razorclaw ability is exactly like TWF without actually calling it that.

 

[DanMcS]

According to the ECS (page 20) under Razorclaw it states the Shifter would attack with a melee weapon in primary hand and a claw as an off-hand weapon with all attacks at -2. This statement totally goes against that of the SRD. (Sorry, I cannot quote the ECS since it is not OGC).

Yes, you can. You can't publish it in another product, because it's not OGC, but you're not a publisher.

"She can attack with one claw as a standard action or with two claws as a full attack action (as a primary natural weapon). Se cannot attack more than once per round with a single claw, even if her base attack bonus is high enough to give her multiple attacks. She can attack with a claw as a light off-hand weapon while wielding a weapon in her primary hand, but all her attacks in that round take a -2 penalty."

It's essentially the two-weapon fighting feat for free, but only with her claw as the off-hand weapon. Yes, this is a specific rule that would override another section of the rules about fighting with natural and manufactured weapons.

 

[Hypersmurf]

"She can attack with one claw as a standard action or with two claws as a full attack action (as a primary natural weapon). Se cannot attack more than once per round with a single claw, even if her base attack bonus is high enough to give her multiple attacks. She can attack with a claw as a light off-hand weapon while wielding a weapon in her primary hand, but all her attacks in that round take a -2 penalty."

Looks like you'd have an option, then, of making your longsword/claw attack as +0/+0 (TWF) or +2/-3 (manufactured weapon with secondary natural weapon).

-Hyp.

 

[Klaus]

Plus, as ECS states (from the quote above), TWF, ITWF and GTWF have no effect on the secondary claw attack. Even if your base attack is +11 and you have GTWF, you still get only one claw attack.

Curiously, the Longfang Shifter (gains bite attack) follows the -0/-5 rule for manufactured+natural weapons.

 

[Methos of Aundair]

Originally quoted from DanMcS

Yes, you can. You can't publish it in another product, because it's not OGC, but you're not a publisher.

I didn’t realize that, thanks for the information.

Originally posted by Hypersmurf

Looks like you'd have an option, then, of making your longsword/claw attack as +0/+0 (TWF) or +2/-3 (manufactured weapon with secondary natural weapon).

-Hyp.

I don’t really believe the player will consider that a very hard choice on which to choose. Lol!

Thanks everyone for the information. I assumed it was a specific rule meant only for the Shifter Razorclaw but wanted to make sure I hadn’t overlooked something. Plus it seemed odd as to why they would disregard their own rule.