D&D 5E Should martial characters be mundane or supernatural?

[Scribe]

An argument for removing Counterspell altogether.

 

[Corinnguard]

It is.

Most of my complaints about 5e are DM side as I'm usually a DM. I can fix them. But most DMs don't or don't know how and then we have these threads.

So you're seeing all of this from a DM's perspective then. You probably had found a solution to a number of complains put to you by those who played in your gaming sessions. Did you have any problems playing a character under another DM? To me it sounds like you did since you mentioned how some don't fix or don't know how to fix a problem that comes up.

The reason why threads such as these exist is so that the OP can get input on a problem they're having a problem with, to satisfy an itch, and to find out that there are others who are in the same boat as they are. The OP for this thread IMO was trying to satisfy an itch. They had their own thoughts about the question, but they grew curious about what everyone else felt about it. So they asked and they knew they were going to get more than one answer. The question is a subjective one.

 

[ECMO3]

But a fighter shouldn't need to receive boot of speed to run faster and boots of striding and springing to jump farther. A normal human so trains physically for years would do so normally.

They don't need to. They have 2 more feats than most classes and those feats can be used to do this exact thing (aside from subclasses that can do them as well).

If I am to take this argument at face value the fix is easy - give all fighters Athlete feat at 4th level and mobile at 6th, take away those ASIs, now the class is fixed and they get as many other ASIs going forward as most classes.

Only you can already do that if that is the fighter you want to play, so why do we need to make this part of the class? Just take those options if that is the fighter you want.

Like I said way in the beginning, a high level mundane martial is possible. It just requires making a bunch of the weaker magic items class features and thus expanding the turns of martials to those of casters or even longer.

If you give the class magic item features it is not mundane.

A high level mundane is already possible if you specifically choose mundane subclass, race and feat options. Not only is it possible, it is viable too.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Any reasoning for that? No meme is going to convince me.

 

[ECMO3]

So we're fighting to preserve a sliver of the game that has become more and more irrelevant as time has gone on. It's time for D&D to fully embrace the superhero trope it's danced around for years and make all classes capable of overt supernatural abilities. Maybe we'll finally see this fighter/wizard discrepancy fade when both classes can access similar tools without jumping though narrative hoops.

I don't find this argument very compelling. To be honest I don't think a better argument would be to say it is time for D&D to embrace magic and give all classes spells instead of maintaining an out of date non-magic trope. That is far more viable with both the current designers and player base I think.

 

[Minigiant]

An argument for removing Counterspell altogether.

D&D could just ask the MTG people.

D&D is 25 years behind MTG on counterspelling and mage duels.

 

[Corinnguard]

It's time for D&D to fully embrace the superhero trope

WoTC would have a hard time catching up to Green Ronin's Mutants and Masterminds.

 

[Scribe]

Any reasoning for that? No meme is going to convince me.

Counter play, via a mechanic to shut down a spell cast, is absolutely crucial to me.

 

[ECMO3]

The reason why threads such as these exist is so that the OP can get input on a problem they're having a problem with, to satisfy an itch, and to find out that there are others who are in the same boat as they are. The OP for this thread IMO was trying to satisfy an itch.

Maybe I misunderstood the original post. I think this thread has devolved into a debate on martials, but I don't think that was the intent. My understanding of the OP is it was a question about what type of fighter you should build:

Should martial characters be mundane or supernatural Simple enough question. What are your thoughts?

I don't see this post as about scratching an itch. I see it as a question:

Should players build mundane martials, for example a Human Champion with GWM and PAM feats.

OR

Should players build supernatural martials, for example a Hexblood Psi Warrior throwing Hex with Fey Touched and Telepathic feats.

Both of these martials have the same class, both will be effective in play, yet both thematically are very different from a role play and combat perspective.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Counter play, via a mechanic to shut down a spell cast, is absolutely crucial to me.

What would you do to make said mechanic fun to play on both sides of the screen? Because right now, for my money it ain't.