Skill checks for faster movement?

[Ymdar]

Thoughts?

If you allow the monsters to do this I think it is reasonable. Might change the dynamic of combat but cold work.

 

[Sadras]

Just keep in mind the Haste spell.

 

[Hriston]

I recently DM'd a session that resulted in PCs dashing to and fro around an airship looking for intruders and/or missing crewman after spectral undead attacked their vessel.


I dawned on me that the PHB (p.190-192) rules, covering moving up to a characters Speed and taking Dash actions, provide for consistent reliable movements rates but make no allowance for characters willing to push themselves at the risk of failure or some kind of disadvantage.

Why are you using the combat movement rules? What you describe doesn’t sound like combat. The travel pace rules seem more appropriate. They let players choose a fast pace of 400 feet per minute as opposed to the 300 feet per minute PCs can normally move, in exchange for accepting a penalty to passive Perception, which seems like just the sort of thing you’re after. This would also allow the PCs to search for intruders and missing crewmen while they move about the ship as you’ve described, albeit at a penalty.

If timing is so critical that round by round resolution is required, you might want to have a look at the chase rules in the DMG. Under those rules, you can only use the Dash action a number of times equal to 3 + your CON modifier, after which you must succeed on a DC 10 CON check each additional time you take the Dash action or suffer a level of exhaustion. Personally, I set the same limit on the use of Dash in normal combat.

Instinctively I allowed Athletics or Acrobatics checks for characters to sprint or parkour their way around the vessel at faster movement rates and in the time since I have tried to devise a balanced homebrew rule I can use consistently, while wondering if anyone else already has something similar they use.

A DEX check is called out in the rule book as modeling an attempt to move quickly, but if you’re already in turn-based resolution then you’ve asked the players for DEX checks to determine initiative. Which brings me back to the question: Who are they trying to move more quickly than?

 

[Tersival]

The travel pace rules seem more appropriate. They let players choose a fast pace of 400 feet per minute as opposed to the 300 feet per minute PCs can normally move, in exchange for accepting a penalty to passive Perception...

TBH, I totally missed that option!

If timing is so critical

It was less about timing being *critical* and more about boosting the usefulness of Athletics/Acrobatics plus "running" not being a RAW option.

that round by round resolution is required, you might want to have a look at the chase rules in the DMG. Under those rules, you can only use the Dash action a number of times equal to 3 + your CON modifier, after which you must succeed on a DC 10 CON check each additional time you take the Dash action or suffer a level of exhaustion. Personally, I set the same limit on the use of Dash in normal combat.

Totally agree on the limit, just hadn't thought how to implement it. Chase rules limit will do nicely.

Good thoughts, thanks.

So now I'm thinking add 10' movement with -5 PP penalty at no risk of falling etc. As a middle option with the PP penalty overall.

If you allow the monsters to do this I think it is reasonable. Might change the dynamic of combat but cold work.

Totally an occasional monster option, with a side effect of throwing off rules lawyers who think they know monster speeds.

 

[guachi]

My simple rule is: If you Dash as your Action you can Dash as your Bonus Action.

It only came up once but, boy, did the PCs like it!

Ambush at range. The PCs were downhill and over moderate terrain. I had forgotten the sorcerer had just made 5th level and taken Haste (Forgetting is a good thing as it means I don't create encounters specifically designed around the PCs' abilities).

PCs trip the ambush at about 400', sorcerer casts twin Haste on the two frontline fighters, they charge the ambush and wreck face. It was fun and different.

 

[Greenstone.Walker]

Because if there's not a super real risk, many players would try this move constantly.

I would rule that pushing yourself over the speed granted by a Dash opens yourself up to attack, because you are not paying attention to defence. Maybe every attack against you has advantage?

 

[Tersival]

So, summarising what the feedback makes me lean toward so far, for characters with a base/"walking" Speed of 30...

You can "hustle" for an extra 10' at a cost of -5 to Passive Perception and no other penalty; or

You can "jog" for an extra 15' at a cost of -5 to PP, provided you make a DC15 skill check (Athletics over open ground or Acrobatics over difficult terrain/obstacles), but if you fail by 10 or more you fall prone; or

You can "run" for an extra 30' at a cost of -5 to PP, provided you make a DC20 skill check (Athletics over open ground or Acrobatics over difficult terrain/obstacles), but if you fail by 10 or more you fall prone; and

If you "jog" or "run" during your turn you grant advantage on melee attacks (ranged attacks vs faster targets don't seem like they'd get easier) against you until the beginning of you next turn.


Defcon1's double/triple Dash idea is quite cool but I still like the option of characters pushing themselves at the risk of failure, for extra drama.

 

[TallIan]

How about going even simpler.

Take Guachi's Simple rule, but add: If you dash as your action and bonus action make a DC 15 Athletics check to avoid falling prone, or something similar.

I think that keeps things inline with 5e's philosophy of simple is better, automatically ties the extra movement to base movement, and makes rogues more nimble, rather than faster, in combat (since they can't double dash all the time). You could also include perception or AC penalties

I can foresee some analysis paralysis and/or heavy meta gaming with the choice of an extra 5' or 15' or 30'.

EDIT: The Hustle option I can see being used ALL the time.

 

[cooperjer]

So, summarising what the feedback makes me lean toward so far, for characters with a base/"walking" Speed of 30...

You can "hustle" for an extra 10' at a cost of -5 to Passive Perception and no other penalty; or

You can "jog" for an extra 15' at a cost of -5 to PP, provided you make a DC15 skill check (Athletics over open ground or Acrobatics over difficult terrain/obstacles), but if you fail by 10 or more you fall prone; or

You can "run" for an extra 30' at a cost of -5 to PP, provided you make a DC20 skill check (Athletics over open ground or Acrobatics over difficult terrain/obstacles), but if you fail by 10 or more you fall prone; and

If you "jog" or "run" during your turn you grant advantage on melee attacks (ranged attacks vs faster targets don't seem like they'd get easier) against you until the beginning of you next turn.


Defcon1's double/triple Dash idea is quite cool but I still like the option of characters pushing themselves at the risk of failure, for extra drama.

If you keep all of this in mind when trying to keep action moving, then I would be amazed. I would use the two rules as mentioned before.

1) Acrobatics or athletics to move across difficult terrain (i.e. parkour) more easily at a value based on DM fiat describing the terrain.
2) Chase scene rules where Dash can be used only so many times.

There is one class feature in the druid and ranger that allows movement through difficult terrain as though it's normal terrain depending on the vegetation. These features could come into play in your next chase or search scene.

 

[Tersival]

If you keep all of this in mind when trying to keep action moving, then I would be amazed. I would use the two rules as mentioned before.

1) Acrobatics or athletics to move across difficult terrain (i.e. parkour) more easily at a value based on DM fiat describing the terrain.`
2) Chase scene rules where Dash can be used only so many times.

There is one class feature in the druid and ranger that allows movement through difficult terrain as though it's normal terrain depending on the vegetation. These features could come into play in your next chase or search scene.

Oh I don't plan on implementing this option *often*, I'm just keen to have a balanced option for suitable moments when it feels right.

I prefer to modify base speed rather than ignoring difficult terrain precisely because some classes have special abilities re difficult terrain and I'm reluctant to infringe on that (those?) edge(s?).