So...am I evil??

[Ruin Explorer]

It's only years later that I remembered this incident, and realized that it had "cooled" the relationship between him and I.

Indeed, it's often only in retrospect that you see what actually damaged the relationship, and it's often odd things, not like the things which, on TV or in a book would be the "most dramatic". And trust is a really difficult one, because once it's been broken intentionally... well...

I do think apologising, bringing the 4E books back, and negotiating can probably rescue this, at least partially. Then the son will probably think his dad is human and a bit silly, but the trust-break will be reduced and that's what matters long-term. That couldn't even happen in my case, even though my dad clearly realized he had perhaps gone too far after the fact.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

I want to go back to how dysfunctional this is...

i thought at first "This must be a young kid, maybe a teen"

BUT!!!! Then he said the sonplayed AD&D... if he could read and write and roll dice to play I would think he had to be at least 5ish years old (I did let my niece try 4e at 4) so 20-23 years old minimum... this son might be like me and almost 40.


As for someone saying "If you hide someones car it's a practical joke".... no, it is not a joke. It is a crime. It is Grand Theft Auto for gods sake. You took without permission, meaning you could go to JAIL!!!

 

[TwoSix]

Wow...lots to unpack here.

1) If the son was old enough to play AD&D, that must put him, at minimum, right around 30. So he's an adult, and this is about an adult father-son relationship, so the power dynamic issues aren't as much at play here. (If the son is actually much younger and still financially dependent on his father, that puts a different spin on things.)

2) The fact that the father is the only one left in the 4e group, and the son continues to want to run the game despite evidence he's the only one interested makes me a little concerned. At the very least, it looks like he has a strong tendency towards system mastery as his primary game motivation (especially considering the details like he reads the books cover to cover to remember all the information). Trying to keep playing a game that's descended down to 1 player also suggests some difficulty either reading or accepting social cues.

3) Hiding books and replacing them with new ones suggests that the inability to process social cues correctly might just have a genetic basis. If you're 50+ and your son is 30+, you should be able to have a conversation like "Look, I'm not a big fan of 4e anymore, and I'm the only one still playing. I respect that you like the system, but I'm just not interested in playing anymore. Why don't we take a crack at playing 5e with your sister's group instead?" If having a frank conversation with another adult about your needs and expectations causes arguments and hurt feelings instead of a rational, respectful discussion, that's really something to bring to a therapist, not a D&D message board. Because, honestly, this isn't an issue about D&D, it's about setting boundaries in a relationship with your adult children.

 

[Satyrn]

Hmm, I hadn't thought about that. That's a good idea. If it turns out that he hates the idea and the 4e books are put back up on the shelf and the 5e books taken down...I might suggest he try that.

I get that your goal was to push your son into broadening his interests so that he could socialize more while enjoying his hobby. Your first attempt wasn't successful, but oh well

I think you should do more than just suggest he try online gaming, but also put in at least double the effort on helping him (if he wants it) than you put in to the 5e-upgrade scheme . . . and maybe trade him computer gear for those 5e books back.

 

[pming]

Hiya!

Nope. Not an evil act. Hell, I don't even think it was a "dick move"...close though. I wouldn't have 'hidden them'. I would have just had all the 5e books on the table around me as I read one or make a character as he got home. He'd then ask "What cha'doin?"...followed by explaining that I was getting bored of 4e and enjoying it less, so figured I'd look at/get into the new 5e game all the cool kids are playing. Then point out something cool about it (like Backgrounds or Archtypes). ...and ask if he wants to give it a shot for a couple sessions.

Then again, if *I* came home and my wife/husband/son/daughter/whatever had hidden all my Hackmaster 4ed books and replaced them with D&D 4e...there'd be manslaughter charges pending!

The whole "take 4e, hide them, replace with 5e, then state 'we are doing this now'" *is* a bit heavy handed. Still wouldn't call it a dick move, but definitely pushing the edge.

^_^

Paul L. Ming

 

[Tony Vargas]

Does that make me evil?

...if you have to ask...

 

[Satyrn]

...if you have to ask...

Am I too sexy for this thread?

 

[Ancalagon]

Wow...lots to unpack here.

1) If the son was old enough to play AD&D, that must put him, at minimum, right around 30. So he's an adult, and this is about an adult father-son relationship, so the power dynamic issues aren't as much at play here. (If the son is actually much younger and still financially dependent on his father, that puts a different spin on things.)

2) The fact that the father is the only one left in the 4e group, and the son continues to want to run the game despite evidence he's the only one interested makes me a little concerned. At the very least, it looks like he has a strong tendency towards system mastery as his primary game motivation (especially considering the details like he reads the books cover to cover to remember all the information). Trying to keep playing a game that's descended down to 1 player also suggests some difficulty either reading or accepting social cues.

3) Hiding books and replacing them with new ones suggests that the inability to process social cues correctly might just have a genetic basis. If you're 50+ and your son is 30+, you should be able to have a conversation like "Look, I'm not a big fan of 4e anymore, and I'm the only one still playing. I respect that you like the system, but I'm just not interested in playing anymore. Why don't we take a crack at playing 5e with your sister's group instead?" If having a frank conversation with another adult about your needs and expectations causes arguments and hurt feelings instead of a rational, respectful discussion, that's really something to bring to a therapist, not a D&D message board. Because, honestly, this isn't an issue about D&D, it's about setting boundaries in a relationship with your adult children.

I concur. It's less bad with two adults involved but... it's still kinda strange that this had to happen. You (the father) and your son don't seem to communicate very well.

 

[Eis]

there are a couple things I don't understand...you keep saying that you enjoy 4e....but you don't like playing it with your son? and...somehow giving your son's age would be giving too much information about him on the internet? that doesn't make much sense to me....this whole thing is really bizarre

 

[jgsugden]

I'd love for the kid to post up his thoughts here...