D&D 5E Some spells _really_ powerful?

[Bryk]

I'm not sure how 2d8 damage with a cantrip is the same as 4d6+8. It's average 9 damage vs average 23. That's without factoring it hit chances. Most enemies have about +1 to saves. It's DC 15 to save for a 18 Wis cleric. So enemies save on a 14+ or about 35% of the time. Most enemies have AC 13 or so which means the fighter hits on a 6. So, they hit 75% of the time. That means it is 5.85 vs 17.25. So, the fighter does nearly triple damage.

That's assuming 5th level Fighter with 18 strength using a greatsword vs 5th level Cleric using Sacred Flame.

Way to chery pick a specific class versus class comparison at a level of your choice with a weapon of your choice. The Cleric can have a Spiritual Weapon going, and have a shield out.

A Wizard can Haste themself at level 5 and cast 2 cantrips, each doing 2d12, so 4d12, or at 6 when they get potent cantrip for half on a miss. 11 When it is 3d12 x 2, 14 when they are all maxxed for either 72, 54 or 36 damage per turn.

 

[Andor]

4 hours of chatting out bad tactics before a fight is crazy. It's one thing if they are back at the tavern, but if they are lurking outside the badguys door for 30+ min in game, something should happen. The monsters aren't just frozen in stasis while the PCs talk. They are going to wander around, take potty breaks, get a snack or even finish using the McGuffin to summon the Eater of Niceness. Have a roll on the wandering monster table and see what taps them on the shoulder while they dither.

I ran my first session Sunday. In 4 hours of play we had 4 combat encounters with multiple encounters getting split up and merged together due to party tactics and maneuvering. And that was with a fair amout of RPing, although minimal NPC interaction. And I has 2 players on Skype.

 

[Majoru Oakheart]

Way to chery pick a specific class versus class comparison at a level of your choice with a weapon of your choice. The Cleric can have a Spiritual Weapon going, and have a shield out.

A Wizard can Haste themself at level 5 and cast 2 cantrips, each doing 2d12, so 4d12, or at 6 when they get potent cantrip for half on a miss. 11 When it is 3d12 x 2, 14 when they are all maxxed for either 72, 54 or 36 damage per turn.

Haste doesn't do that. It lets you take an action that only lets you Attack(one weapon attack only), Dash, Disengage, Hide, or Use an Object. Nothing in there let's you cast a second cantrip.

How are you maxing them all? I assume you are using Overchannel. It's...technically legal to use it on cantrips. Though Mike Mearls said that it was legal "as written", which implies that he doesn't want to issue errata without discussing it with the rest of the team. He then proceeds to say that even he would house rule it to increase the damage by 1d12.

I would just not allow Overchannel on cantrips.

 

[variant]

Way to chery pick a specific class versus class comparison at a level of your choice with a weapon of your choice. The Cleric can have a Spiritual Weapon going, and have a shield out.

A cleric using their highest spell slot at level 11 can deal 3d8+5 damage with their Spiritual Weapon.

A Wizard can Haste themself at level 5 and cast 2 cantrips, each doing 2d12, so 4d12, or at 6 when they get potent cantrip for half on a miss. 11 When it is 3d12 x 2, 14 when they are all maxxed for either 72, 54 or 36 damage per turn.

Haste cannot allow casters to cast an additional spell. It can only be used to take an additional Attack, Dash, Disengage, Hide or Use an Object action.

 

[Thaumaturge]

I'm running a 5e conversion of Ruins of Undermountain. My players are paranoid about touching anything, and will spend forever looking at an iron torch holder on the wall. They love to socialize and roleplay.

On Saturday we got through 4-5 encounters in 3ish hours.

Thaumaturge.

 

[gideonpepys]

I'm also a bit worried about Monks.

Why?

 

[doctorhook]

A lot of it comes from sandbox world, players deciding what to do next. I no longer allow strategy talk during combat, you are allowed up to 6 seconds, and like I said reaction if required if it isn't your turn. That doesn't prevent the pre-fight strategy where the players discuss 3-5 bad ideas and out of the 3 bad ideas end up deciding on the worst most of the time. I don't care for railroading personally, nor hand holding. I do let the players determine how they want to approach things when applicable. Obviously being surprised is a different story.

A player's turn can take some time, as they are zoned out from others taking too long on their turn deciding from their countless options. I try to ask for 30 second caps to your turn to decide, but even saying "15", ... "5"... can only go so far.

I should probably kick out the players that don't even know the rules by now after playing for nearly a year, but it is frustrating finding reliable back-fills, especially with being half way through a 2 year campaign series.

I can relate to this; my last group (4E) was like this. The players were all around 18-20, and only interested in D&D as a distraction from WoW. Six players like that, watching YouTube videos and interrupting others' turns to show of something funny and never ready for their turn--I don't really miss that. I used to try to enforce time-limits with them too, but mostly that just antagonized everyone. (I did switch to the "Players Roll the Dice" variant, and that went a long way towards keeping my players focused.)

It sounds to me like you know exactly what the problem is: your players (or at least some of them). I know how hard it can be to replace them, and I don't envy your position. Best of luck.

 

[Agamon]

I'm also a bit worried about Monks.

Why?

Have you seen the abilities of Way of the Shadow?



They could be anywhere...

 

[Schmoe]

A lot of it comes from sandbox world, players deciding what to do next. I no longer allow strategy talk during combat, you are allowed up to 6 seconds, and like I said reaction if required if it isn't your turn. That doesn't prevent the pre-fight strategy where the players discuss 3-5 bad ideas and out of the 3 bad ideas end up deciding on the worst most of the time. I don't care for railroading personally, nor hand holding. I do let the players determine how they want to approach things when applicable. Obviously being surprised is a different story.

A player's turn can take some time, as they are zoned out from others taking too long on their turn deciding from their countless options. I try to ask for 30 second caps to your turn to decide, but even saying "15", ... "5"... can only go so far.

I generally have a rule at my table that players have about 30 seconds to decide on a course of action. At the end of that time, they are considered to be "delaying" and I move on to the next person. As soon as the player makes up his or her mind, the player can jump in, but otherwise they are considered to be paralyzed by indecision It really helps to keep combat time down, and since I as DM rarely take more than 5-10 seconds to decide on the opponent's course of action, I think it's pretty fair.

 

[sithramir]

3 Fighter Champion, 8 Barbarian Berserker.

Great Axe, 1d12, 3 Attacks, 2 from multi, bonus is Frenzy, Reckless attack gives advantage. +5 from STR, +10 from Great Weapon Master.

Fighter gives Great Weapon Fighting (reroll on 1 or 2), Action Surge, 19/20 Critical.

I don't have PHB in front of me but i'm confused.

Barbarian can't get 3 attacks? Multi-attack only give 2 attacks? What is Frenzy?

+5 from Str. The +10 from Great Weapon Master is only if you kill a creature and take a bonus action of -5 to ad +10 so it's only if a creature dies that you can use this? It's not on every attack?

SO you're saying you get 3 attacks because monsters are dying and you still hit even with the -5 penalty?

Glad i reread barbarian because i thought they didn't get bonus actions in rage but i guess they just don't get "reactions". ??

Just something doesn't add up but i'd like to understand it