Spells, Powers, and Damage Reduction

[DM2]

Hi Guys,

The DMG is pretty clear that Damage Reduction does not apply against spells or spell like abilities.

However, does that include spells or powers that do non-magical damage types. For instance, I'm considering taking the first level psionic power Crystal Shard, which is a ray attack that does 1d6 points of "piercing" damage to an opponent.

Would an opponent's Damage Reduction (of any variety) apply against that spell?

If not, it looks quite good for me, as it can scale with my level, only requires a ranged touch attack to hit, and has no saving throw AND no power resistance.

Later,

DM2

 

[dcollins]

I would say "no, it bypasses DR". I think a similar debate occured in the past about blade barrier (its says slashing damage) and I'm pretty sure the Sage replied that it's still a spell, still magic, so DR as usual fails to apply.

 

[fett527]

Interesting. I am playing a druid and considered using the Splinterbolt from WoTC online article here

Splinterbolt
Evocation
Level: Druid 2, Sorcerer/Wizard 2
Components: V, S, M
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)
Effect: One or more streams of splinters
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: Yes

You cause a long, thin, sharp beam of splinters to lance out of your outstretched hand to strike a target in range. You must make a ranged attack (not a ranged touch attack) to hit the target; if you hit, the splinterbolt deals 4d6 points of piercing damage. The splinterbolt threatens a critical hit on an 18-20 and deals x3 damage on a successful critical hit.

You can fire one additional splinterbolt for every four levels beyond 3rd (to a maximum of three splinterbolts at 11th level). You can fire these splinterbolts at the same or different targets, but all splinterbolts must be aimed at targets within 30 feet of each other and fired simultaneously.

If you cast this spell in forested terrain, the splinterbolts are treated as cold iron magic weapons, and they deal an additional +4 points of damage on a hit.

Material Component: A splinter of wood.

Granted I think some of it is a little much, but we decided much the opposite on DR/SR and said DR would apply but SR would not. Hmmmm... any more thoughts?

 

[Camarath]

Granted I think some of it is a little much, but we decided much the opposite on DR/SR and said DR would apply but SR would not. Hmmmm... any more thoughts?

Why did you decide that Spell Resistance did not apply when that spell clearly states that it does?

 

[fett527]

Why did you decide that Spell Resistance did not apply when that spell clearly states that it does?

Because I'm stupid and forgot that we had already pointed that out. That's what I get for responding early in the morning without thinking. I deeply apologize for my error

 

[Lamoni]

If you cast this spell in forested terrain, the splinterbolts are treated as cold iron magic weapons, and they deal an additional +4 points of damage on a hit.

That sure makes it sound like this spell was written as if DR did apply. The only use of having something treated as cold iron magic weapons is to overcome DR. If DR didn't apply, it would be meaningless to add that... although the +4 points of damage would still be applicable.

Since this spell isn't in a core rulebook though we can't really make any generalizations about all spells based off of this one though.

 

[noeuphoria]

I think blade barrier has been cleared up. The "slashing blades" is descriptive text. The blades themselves are force effects, so deal force damage just like spiritual weapon and magic missile. That being said, I think there are spells where DR definitely applies. Ice storm does "2d6 bludgeoning", we've always played that dr reduces that. Likewise, I would say that any spell that explicitly states it does bludgeoning, piercing or slashing damage is subject to damage reduction. Especially the splinterbolt. The fact it requires an attack roll and not a ranged touch speaks to me that essentially the caster is physically attacking someone, much like shooting an arrow.

 

[DM2]

I think blade barrier has been cleared up. The "slashing blades" is descriptive text. The blades themselves are force effects, so deal force damage just like spiritual weapon and magic missile. That being said, I think there are spells where DR definitely applies. Ice storm does "2d6 bludgeoning", we've always played that dr reduces that. Likewise, I would say that any spell that explicitly states it does bludgeoning, piercing or slashing damage is subject to damage reduction. Especially the splinterbolt. The fact it requires an attack roll and not a ranged touch speaks to me that essentially the caster is physically attacking someone, much like shooting an arrow.

Then again, now that I look at it, if DR really applied then why would it still be a touch attack?

In other words, if because a spell says it does "piercing" damage it should be treated like any other piercing attack, why wouldn't armor protect against it?

The DMG is very clear in saying that spells ignore DR...is there another source suggesting otherwise?

Thanks for the great replies all!

DM2

 

[Hypersmurf]

Then again, now that I look at it, if DR really applied then why would it still be a touch attack?

"Damage reduction does not negate touch attacks..."

Since Crystal Shard is a touch attack, DR does not negate it.

-Hyp.

 

[Brisk-sg]

Hum. This brings up a good point. If DR never applies to spells, then why do some spells outline a damage type that is associated with weapons. The whole reason for knowing. those damage types is because of things like a skeletons DR 5/bludgeoning.

Basically if it says 'piercing' or 'bludgeoning' in a spell description, and DR never applies to spells (which I did not know, I thought it still applied to things like bludgeoning from ice storm) then these are little more then description, and they are basically unnamed damage you cannot get a resistance (such as resist fire) for. Interesting.