Sprint Skill (also adds a chase mechanic)

[Lord Zardoz]

Sprint Skill (Str; Armour Check Penalty, Usable untrained)

Class Skill for: Identical to Jump.


Check: With a successful check, you can increase your movement rate temporarily during any action involving movement where you are moving under your own power (Move, Double Move, Run, Charging). The DC for the check is based on the kind of movement you are trying to undertake. Characters that are sprinting lose their Dex bonus to AC unless they have the Run feat. The amount of extra movement gained depends on the result of the Sprint check;

Movement / DC
+5 / 10
+10 / 15
+15 / 25
+20 / 40
+25 / 60
+30 / 85

(The pattern it follows is that for the 2nd line onward, you add the previous lines DC + extra movement. +10 movement is +5 movement + DC 10, +15 movement is 10 + DC 15).

Sprinting in difficult terrain adds an extra 10 to the Sprint DC.

Each round of movement forces the user to make a Fort save or become temporarily Fatigued (-2 to Str and Dex, no Run or Charge actions). The DC of the Fort Save is equal to 4 for each consecutive round of Sprinting, so DC 12 on the 3rd round of sprinting). If Fatigued due to sprinting, the character may reroll the save if they spend a full round resting. The Fatigue lasts until the character succeeds in the save.

Special: A character with the Run Feat gets +4 to Sprint checks, and can consider Sprint a class skill if it was not already. A character with Endurance gets a +4 to the Save DC's.

synergy: If you have 5 or more ranks in Sprint, you gain a +2 on Jump and Swim checks. If you have 5 or more ranks in Swim, you get a +2 bonus to Swim checks.

Other: Non aquatic Characters must use Swim checks to Sprint in water, but may use the above DC`s. If a character has multiple movement modes, it must select which movement mode the check applies to (ie, for a Dragon, it can choose Sprint(Ground) or Sprint(Flying).

Intent: The Sprint skill will give characters a reasonable chance of adding an extra bit of movement to their movement rate during their turn. The initial low Fort save DC makes it reasonable for races with Movement 20 to use to close for melee range. The risk of being Fatigued for any length of time will prevent people from using it as a permanent movement increase. But the save is easy enough that from time to time, it can mean the difference between getting a move + attack in vs no attack at all due to a Double move.

More importantly, this also adds a chase mechanic to the game. With the rules as written, you cannot have an interesting tactical scale chase. With these rules, you can. If someone has any sort of movement advantage, they will catch up. Due to the DC`s involved, is unlikely to allow someone to outrun a Barbarian or Monk in a sustained chase.

Potential for improvement:
I like the rate of DC increase, but I am not entirely satisfied with the penalty for over use. The DC curve is a bit steep for tactical chase scenarios, but I do not want this skill to become a defacto movement increase. With the current increase rate in DC, a character with Maxed ranks at level 5 give a good chance of adding +10 to +15 to movement on each check. But even at level 15, it will be very rare to hit +20 movement. Given that armour check penalties apply, reducing the DC by 5 points across the board may not hurt too much. I would like this skill to let a Mv 30 character with a decent number of ranks a fighting chance at outrunning a Barbarian.

The Fatigue penalty is a bit harder to figure in. For two characters that can run at x4, a +10 in movement rate adds up to a lead of an 40 feet per round. Getting Fatigued even temporarily will let someone who is still moving at x4 Run will probably result catching up the moment the one fleeing fails the fatigue check. I suppose the DC for the Fort save can increase a bit more slowly.

Your thoughts?

END COMMUNICATION

 

[Lord Zardoz]

Hmm....

62 views, and no responses. I suppose I can conclude one of the following.

1) I have done a fine job, no one has any suggestions.
2) I have done a crappy job. no one wants to be caught dead commenting in this thread.
3) No one cares about new skills / tactical chase mechanics.

heh, Oh well.

END COMMUNICATION

 

[TheCrazyMuffinMan]

Awesome, just don't know why i'd lose my dex bonus while moving faster. Is it because I can't suddenly change motion away from harm while -sprint-ing?

 

[Lord Zardoz]

Same thing happens when you use a Run movement rate without the Run feat, and I was mostly aiming for consistency.

I am still not entirely satisfied with the DC progression / over use penalty though. Its pretty tricky to balance a DC progression for something like this without creating something that becomes a full time movement increase.

END COMMUNICATION

 

[ChimericDream]

I really like this idea. I agree that the DC for the fatigued state still needs work. I'm thinking that even a mid level character with decent ability mod and max ranks could sprint for quite awhile without fatiguing.

Consider a 10th level fighter with a Str of 18 and Fort of +13 (+7 base, +4 con mod, +3 resistance item... not unreasonable). With max ranks, he has a +18 on his sprint check. So we've got a fighter who can add +15 to his base speed (on average) for several rounds before he really has to worry about failing the Fort save (it's only on the 4th consecutive round that he has to roll higher than a 1 to pass).

I'd say up the DC to a straight 15 + double the number of rounds you've been sprinting. Also, what about making sprint a Con based skill? It seems to me to be more of an endurance thing anyway... sort of pushing your body to the limit to see how far it can go.

Overall I love the idea.

 

[Li Shenron]

I think the first DC is a bit low... I'd make it 15 or even 20.

Otherwise it looks like a fine idea.

 

[Celebrim]

I think you're biggest problem is someone has already beaten you to this mechanic and done it better.

Have you ever seen the 'Hot Pursuit' rules?

I grant you that they aren't perfect, but if I needed a flight/chase mechanic to be central to a scene, that is where I'd be turning. You are quite correct to notice the extreme deficiency of d20's flight/chase rules, but I think without going in the cinematic direction that 'Hot Pursuit' takes the game that you really aren't gaining a whole lot.

No, that out of the way, I agree that 'move fast' should be a skill, and I agree that it should be strenght based (good call!). So, I like the direction you are taking the rules, I just don't think you go far enough.

I think you make moving fast too easy, and I think you are right to suggest that the penalty for overuse is your biggest problem. Part of the problem is that D20 uncomfortably supports fatigue rules, so its hard to do anything here. I don't think your dice throwing is meaningful or adds to the game. You system gets too dice happy for not enough play value. Try to reduce the dice rolling down from two dice to one in most circumstances. Save the rolls for extended sprints.

Throwing out a stream of consciousness here, the base DC of sprinting should go up by +5 when making a double move, and by +10 for a run (you are already assumed to be exherting yourself when doing that), you should retain your dodge AC against missile attacks when sprinting and even gain an additional dodge bonus based on your total movement rate (say +1 per 40'), sprinting when also attacking in the same round (whether charging or anything else) should carry both a two hit penalty and a penalty to ac if you make an attack unless you engage in either an overrun or bull rush attack (you are going to fast to control anything more precise). Limit the total time sprinting in a single hour, to like CON/2. Up to that, you don't have to roll endurance checks. After that, endurance checks get rapidly more difficult. Each time you 'max out', decrease this total time you can sprint safely in other hours of the day. Once you get into a 'pushing it' zone where you are up to two dice throws a round, consider a very high penalty for continuing to push it and failing like muscle injury (critical failure, take Str or Dex damage) in addition to fatigue.

 

[Lord Zardoz]

I think you make moving fast too easy, and I think you are right to suggest that the penalty for overuse is your biggest problem. ....

Throwing out a stream of consciousness here, the base DC of sprinting should go up by +5 when making a double move, and by +10 for a run (you are already assumed to be exherting yourself when doing that), you should retain your dodge AC against missile attacks when sprinting and even gain an additional dodge bonus based on your total movement rate (say +1 per 40'), sprinting when also attacking in the same round (whether charging or anything else) should carry both a two hit penalty and a penalty to ac if you make an attack unless you engage in either an overrun or bull rush attack (you are going to fast to control anything more precise). Limit the total time sprinting in a single hour, to like CON/2. Up to that, you don't have to roll endurance checks. After that, endurance checks get rapidly more difficult. Each time you 'max out', decrease this total time you can sprint safely in other hours of the day. Once you get into a 'pushing it' zone where you are up to two dice throws a round, consider a very high penalty for continuing to push it and failing like muscle injury (critical failure, take Str or Dex damage) in addition to fatigue.

I think we are a bit divergent in our approaches to the difficulty of using this type of skill. You suggest making the DC's higher, but having a reduced penalty. I went with having reasonably easy DC's with a harsh penalty on over use. Lower DC's make the skill usable at low levels. Having a +10 Movement burst attainable at low levels makes the skill worth while. At only +5 movement being attainable, it is really not that worth while. Also, keeping the DC's lower makes the skill useable untrained. I would very much like to be able to run a chase sequence with untrained characters using it.

Also, while my original method is a bit Dice happy, your suggestions tend towards heavier book keeping.

Still, there are some things in your suggestion I like.

- Using ability damage rather than the Fatigued condition as a deterrent.
- Having a preset limit on uses before forcing Fort saves.
- Having the skill interact with Bull rush and Over run.

I am a bit iffy on the increased DC's for Double Move / Run, since that makes untrained use of the skill essentially impossible during a chase. But you are right that when using a Run movement, you are already exerting yourself.

I am at work right now, but I think I will work out some revisions later tonight. Thanks for the ideas.

END COMMUNICATION

 

[Lord Zardoz]

Oh, and I have never seen the Hot Pursuit rules.

END COMMUNICATION

 

[Lord Zardoz]

Revised skill. Changes are bolded

Sprint Skill (Str; Armour Check Penalty, Usable untrained)

Class Skill for: Identical to Jump.

Check: With a successful check, you can increase your movement rate temporarily during any action involving movement where you are moving under your own power (Move, Double Move, Run, Charging). The DC for the check is based on the kind of movement you are trying to undertake. Characters that are sprinting lose their Dex bonus to AC vs melee attacks unless they have the Run feat. The amount of extra movement gained depends on the result of the Sprint check;

Movement / DC
+5 / 10
+10 / 15
+15 / 25
+20 / 40
+25 / 60
+30 / 85

(The pattern it follows is that for the 2nd line onward, you add the previous lines DC + extra movement. +10 movement is +5 movement + DC 10, +15 movement is 10 + DC 15).

Sprinting in difficult terrain adds an extra 10 to the Sprint DC.

Each round of movement forces the user to make a Fort save or suffer temporary ability damage (1d4 Str damage). The DC of the Fort Save is equal to 4 for each consecutive round of Sprinting, so DC 12 on the 3rd round of sprinting). The character may reroll the save if they spend a full round resting. The Fatigue lasts until the character succeeds in the save. For every 4 ranks in Sprint, the character may Sprint for 1 free round before having to make a save.

Because a character is already exerting themselves while using a Run action, the DC for ability damage is 8 per round spent Running / Sprinting.

Special: A character with the Run Feat gets +4 to Sprint checks, and can consider Sprint a class skill if it was not already. A character with Endurance gets a +4 bonus to Fort Saves made to avoid ability damage, and can use Sprint while running at the normal 4 DC per round.

A character who Sprints while making a Bull Rush or Overrun attack may add +2 to their Opposed check for each extra 5 movement added on their Sprint Check.

Synergy: If you have 5 or more ranks in Sprint, you gain a +2 on Jump and Swim checks. If you have 5 or more ranks in Swim, you get a +2 bonus to Swim checks.

Other: Non aquatic Characters must use Swim checks to Sprint in water, but may use the above DC`s. If a character has multiple movement modes, it must select which movement mode the check applies to (ie, for a Dragon, it can choose Sprint(Ground) or Sprint(Flying).

Improvements / changes:
- Dex bonus to AC is only lost vs Melee attacks.
- Sprinting during a Run action is more difficult to sustain due to increased DC increment, unless the user also has Endurance. This makes Run + Endurance even more desireable.
- Ability damage instead of Fatigue is easier to manage, and will not immediately end a chase. This will also make Sprinting more useful to Archers, and more riskier for Melee.
- Sprinting now affects Bullrush and Overrun
- Depending on the number of ranks you have, you may sprint without fear of ability damage for a short time. Because the amount of time is rank dependant, it gives a reason to keep the skill maxed out even after you can reliably hit +15 movement

Your thoughts?

END COMMUNICATION