Tensir's Floating disk of do everything + Cranky DM

[Syrsuro]

The real question is whether I can use it for my level 24 shepherd as a hat to shield myself from the sun, or put a Magic Mouth on the inside of it to make it look like it's about to swallow me whole?!

As a force disk, I'd rule it is transparent (or at least translucent). However, I suppose it is still possible that it could block UV rays and thus prevent sunburn.....

Carl

 

[amysrevenge]

The 4E test for questions like this is:

Does it give an "unfair" advantage? If so, then choose the most restictive rules interpretation. If not, then choose the most liberal rules interpretation.

The difficulty is to decide what is "unfair"

 

[Mistwell]

Is there a comprehensive list of what Tensir's floating disc can and cannot do

I say
* It floats on water

Debatable. Water is not usually considered ground, unless you have a water walking ability.

* Players can ride on it

I agree

* 1 player standing up

\

i would require an acrobatics check to do this

* 2 players counted as a grapple

I do not understand what you mean by this

* 2 players can sit on it back to back

I'd probably allow that, but only for transport and not during combat since you couldn't really aim well like that...also, it depends on their weight of course.

* I can control the height of the floating disc? lets say to scoop something out of a shallow water.

Nope. It floats 1 ft. above the ground, not more, not less.

* Hovers over the ground in a manner which does not trigger any motion, or pressure sensitive material below the belly of the disc.

I agree

* if height can be controlled i could use it as a snow sled?

See above

* It can scale any surface but a vertical sher face.

It floats above the ground. If it's ground, it should be able to move over it.

* can use multiple Tensir disks to carry extremely heavy objects. I.E. snap the wheels off a carriage. use 2 disks to float the carriage back to town.

I would probably allow it but you need two simultaneous move actions to do it...

* when siting / standing on the disk normal movements like shifting, expeditious retreat, the disk moves under you at those speeds

I do not understand what you mean by this. You can move it with a move action based on your speed, or it can follow you at the listed speed.

 

[Banon]

Although I love to encourage creativity in my campaign, nothing irks me more than when people treat Tensir's Floating Disc like it's Tensir's Magic Carpet Ride. If you say, let people ride it across a blank of wood, next they'll try to ride it over a tight rope, and finally ride it over a single strand of spider web bridging some gap. Allow them to hover over water, and next thing you know, they're crossing chasms floating on the Oxygen molecules beneath the disc.

Simply put, TFD should follow 1 simple rule of physics: For any force there is an equal and opposite force. If you put X amount of force ontop of TFD, the dics must exert that much 'magical' force on the ground to sustain it's hover. If the ground cannot support that force, it gives way. This means TFD should trigger preasure sensitve plates, fall through water, and not fly through the air.

It's a Mule for moving stuff, not a mode of transportation.

 

[Tale]

Although I love to encourage creativity in my campaign, nothing irks me more than when people treat Tensir's Floating Disc like it's Tensir's Magic Carpet Ride. If you say, let people ride it across a blank of wood, next they'll try to ride it over a tight rope, and finally ride it over a single strand of spider web bridging some gap. Allow them to hover over water, and next thing you know, they're crossing chasms floating on the Oxygen molecules beneath the disc.

Simply put, TFD should follow 1 simple rule of physics: For any force there is an equal and opposite force. If you put X amount of force ontop of TFD, the dics must exert that much 'magical' force on the ground to sustain it's hover. If the ground cannot support that force, it gives way. This means TFD should trigger preasure sensitve plates, fall through water, and not fly through the air.

It's a Mule for moving stuff, not a mode of transportation.

Screw physics. I like "magic is sapient." You do something stupid or try to get away with something you know you shouldn't, magic gets back at you.

Tenser's Magic Carpet Ride might decide that the middle of a large body of water is the best place to offload its passengers.

 

[Nail]

Simply put, TFD should follow 1 simple rule of physics: For any force there is an equal and opposite force. If you put X amount of force ontop of TFD, the dics must exert that much 'magical' force on the ground to sustain it's hover.

Why?

Your additional rules for TFD neither clarify the situation nor are "required by physics". The TFD magically floats 1 foot above the ground. That is all! None of the following are "the ground": water, tight-rope, a strand of spider silk, or oxygen molecules. Since these are not "the ground", TFD does not float 1 foot above them.

I mean, come on: this is easy stuff.

Now, whether or not you (the caster) can ride your own TFD....that's a real question worth thinking about/parsing text over.

 

[doctorhook]

What does everyone think of the ritual caster riding upon his own disc?

Tenser's Floating Disc (PH p312):

- Is a first level ritual, costing 50gp to learn and 10gp each time it's used.
- Moves at the caster's base speed (probably 6) either on its own, towards the caster, or under the caster's direction as a move action.
- Can easily carry 1000 pounds for a 1st-level character with a high Arcana check (DC 25); can carry up to 2000 pounds (DC 40).
- Can't move vertically above the ground surface, according to the RAW.
- Can be directed by the caster at any distance, although presumably not much more than 5 squares away.​

Flying Carpet (PH p254):

- Is a 20th-level Wondrous Item, costing 125,000gp.
- Can be commanded mentally by a character riding it to fly 6 squares, as an at-will move action.
- Can fly to a maximum altitude of 10 squares. (EDITED to be more in line with the actual text.)
- Can carry a single Medium or Small creature of 300 pounds or less. More than 300 pounds placed upon the carpet causes it (and everything on it) to fall to the ground and take falling damage.
EDIT: - Imposes a -2 penalty to AC and Reflex upon its rider.
​

If Tenser's Floating Disc is able to be used to carry creatures (including the ritual caster), then it's clearly superior to a Flying Carpet in nearly every way. (The carpet wins at altitude.)

I like player creativity, but I won't be allowing these abuses of TFD; it's obviously not the intended use for this ritual, and it makes a 20th-level magic item functionally obsolete.

My suggested rules fix? Tenser's Floating Disc can only carry objects. Creatures either pass through the disc harmlessly, or cause the disc to collapse if they attempt to get on top of the disc.

 

[Lord Zardoz]

I say
* It floats on water
* Players can ride on it
* 1 player standing up
* 2 players counted as a grapple
* 2 players can sit on it back to back
* I can control the height of the floating disc? lets say to scoop something out of a shallow water.
* Hovers over the ground in a manner which does not trigger any motion, or pressure sensitive material below the belly of the disc.
* if height can be controlled i could use it as a snow sled?
* It can scale any surface but a vertical sher face.
* can use multiple Tensir disks to carry extremely heavy objects. I.E. snap the wheels off a carriage. use 2 disks to float the carriage back to town.
* when siting / standing on the disk normal movements like shifting, expeditious retreat, the disk moves under you at those speeds

This sounds a little too much like your trying to apply the most favorable reading in every possible circumstance. If your DM lets all this fly, you have a power that gives you a cargo transport, a boat, and a hovercraft, and battle chariot.

The rituals flavor description says its "like a porter that never needs to rest". I would consider it to be a magical alternative to a donkey cart for hauling supplies or loot. My gut instinct is to treat it like a childs wagon; If you tried to use a child s wagon for the same purpose, you would get the same success.

So to respond directly to some of your ideas...
- Not buoyant. Treat it likes its rolling on the ground
- A player could ride it sitting at no penalty. Standing would call for a balance check.
- No height control
- It does hover, so it could be used to circumvent pressure plate based traps.
- Multiple discs can be used to spread out a load, but a caster can only move one at a time, so it is probably not practical.
- If you were trying to use it in a combat I was running, I would let you move on it (using a move equivalent action). I would disallow shifting. It moves at its own speed.

END COMMUNICATION

 

[Warmduscher]

That's only because a flying carpet is IMO insanely weak for something that costs 125.000 gp. Remove the altitude restrictions and up the number/weight of people riding on it and it makes sense again when compared to the disc.

 

[Nail]

...I won't be allowing these abuses of TFD; it's obviously not the intended use for this ritual,....

Really?

Two questions:

• #1) Which "use" is an "abuse"?
• #2) How do you know there is only one "intended use for this ritual"?