The army behind the army

[Joker]

Mornin' everyone,

I'm fleshing out some parts of a setting I'm working on and right now I'm focusing on the various armies of this campaign.

Does anyone know of any books or documentaries focusing on the logistics of running an army. It's your standard high magic fantasy setting, so any army from any time period will be helpful.

I've read the book "Thermopylae: The Battle for the West" which spends a great deal of ink on the support units and the massive logistical operation of maintaining a huge force so far from home.

My aim is to understand what is needed in detail and see how that translates in a fantasy setting. I think that if I comprehend the little things I can see how magic could supplement or even replace the more conventional means of supporting a large fighting force.

 

[bouncyhead]

I've heard decent things about this:

[ame=http://www.amazon.co.uk/European-Warfare-1350-1750-Frank-Tallett/dp/0521713897/ref=pd_sim_b_4]European Warfare, 1350-1750: Amazon.co.uk: Frank Tallett, D. J. B. Trim: Books[/ame]

 

[bouncyhead]

Also... this looks relevant but eye-spinningly expensive!

[ame=http://www.amazon.co.uk/Logistics-Warfare-Crusades-John-Pryor/dp/0754651975/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1341574872&sr=8-3]Logistics of Warfare in the Age of the Crusades: Amazon.co.uk: John H. Pryor: Books[/ame]

 

[Weregrognard]

De Re Militari (aka [ame="http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004YTJ4D2/ref=pd_lpo_k2_dp_sr_1?pf_rd_p=486539851&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe-1&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=144996950X&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=1WARYDQBF4YNTVF4QNWX"]The Military Institutions of the Romans[/ame])

While written by the late Romans, it was still studied by military officers centuries later.

 

[Grogg of the North]

The Art of War by Sun Tzu touches on the logistics of running an army, the use of spies, and much more. Plus its in the public domain!

 

[Mark CMG]

You might also ask in the Osprey Publishing forums what they have along those lines or even more specific -

Osprey Publishing - Military History Books - Forums

 

[Balesir]

What they said - the J.Pryor one is a series of papers from a seminar of experts and is very good, cutting edge historical views on the crusades period. Plus, as a general overview that really helps give you an overall appreciation, try [ame="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Supplying-War-Logistics-Wallenstein-Patton/dp/0521297931"]"Supplying War" by Martin Van Creveld[/ame].

 

[S'mon]

My aim is to understand what is needed in detail and see how that translates in a fantasy setting. I think that if I comprehend the little things I can see how magic could supplement or even replace the more conventional means of supporting a large fighting force.

Re medieval armies, the main thing to understand is that between the fall of the Western Roman Empire and the future Duke of Marlborough's innovations in the War of Spanish Successsion, Logistics was practically a lost art. Armies lived off the countryside, not from a supply chain, and ravaged whatever land they passed through. A 'friendly' army passing through was thus almost as destructive as invasion by the enemy.

For a fantasy campaign, you can use this for a grim & gritty feel, or perhaps only for evil kingdoms.

 

[saskganesh]

To spare you some (probabaly enjoyable) historical research, I'd recommend tracking down the old Dragon Magazine article "An Army Travels on its Stomach".

 

[Balesir]

Re medieval armies, the main thing to understand is that between the fall of the Western Roman Empire and the future Duke of Marlborough's innovations in the War of Spanish Successsion, Logistics was practically a lost art. Armies lived off the countryside, not from a supply chain, and ravaged whatever land they passed through. A 'friendly' army passing through was thus almost as destructive as invasion by the enemy.

If that is your view, can I suggest reading the J. Pryor book on the logistics of the crusades? It covers the Islamic and Mongol forces involved as well as the Christian, and it seems quite clear that the logistics of all three were quite carefully considered and planned for.

Some key overview points to remember:

- until WW1 troops could generally carry all the ammunition and equipment they might need for a field campaign with them. Sieges posed a slightly different challenge, but even then ammunition could usually be manufactured in situ if necessary.

- armies prior to around 1800 were small enough to be outnumbered by the local civilian population. This meant that the usual method of aquiring food and fodder was to buy or requisition it, since the local people had enough to last until the next harvest, which was easily enough for an army for a few days. This worked fine as long as the army kept moving; sieges were, once again, a special circumstance, requiring carting food in from surrounding areas.

- the main concern of Christian knights, Islamic armies and Mongols during the crusade campaigns was how much fodder and grazing was available in the areas to be advanced through. This decided whether a campaign could be embarked upon or not. It actually played a big part in deciding what campaigns were fought at all, and in some cases a miscalculation led to a retreat or defeat.

So, in summary, I don't think logistics was really a "lost art" at all. The logistics was kept simple by the size of the forces, but that was a two way street (the size of the forces was kept low to enable the logistics to work), and many manoeuvres were enabled by one side being able to field (and supply) an army where another couldn't.