D&D 5E The revival economy

[Magean]

Good ideas here.

Regarding D&D settings, I'm mostly versed in Eberron so that's where, as a DM, I stage my stories. In the world of Eberron (at least in the main continent of Khorvaire), a mercantile organization of Halflings, House Jorasco, holds a monopoly over the healing business and healthcare at large. They run the hospitals, using both mundane and magical healing. And, they're all but a charity. In fact, house members are actually forbidden to heal for free.

So, the question of revival pricing is very relevant to the setting, and yet, I haven't seen it touched anywhere. Considering that the few people able to deliver revival are ruthless profitmakers, we can very well assume that economics apply wholly there; no considerations of "disturbing the natural pattern", "not doing right by the gods"... Things are as described by the OP: very limited and inelastic supply, and probably overabundant demand. I remember reading in an official adventure about a high-ranking noble who had his murdered daughter resurrected... We can then assume people of this social class can afford some form of revival.

However, I'd be inclined to have it priced sufficiently high that even the lower nobility or the upper merchant middle-class can hardly afford it. It's too much of a disturbance to think of the consequences of revival in game terms...

Regarding supply of revival spells, it's also important to remember that, in Eberron, low-level magic is everywhere but NPCs with PC classes are very rare. Your local priest isn't a cleric, he's (at best) just a guy with a bonus to Medicine checks. He can tend to minor wounds, knows some herbs, but that's about it. Even a level 1 cleric is a rarity, so people able to cast a revival spell are so rare that they're essentially miracle-makers and can't chain-revive the dead. Otherwise, they would threaten Jorasco's business and probably die in some unfortunate way, leaving their corpse too damage for resurrection...

 

[Geoarrge]

You have to wonder, specifically, how diamonds would be handled in the economy where their chief use is resurrection insurance. I tend to think that whatever their open market value, diamonds would be hoarded and traded at highly inflated values except perhaps in areas directly around where they are mined.

Consider that chromatic orb and gate both use diamonds as components (not consumed). How does society look at wizards who hold onto diamonds for these purposes?

The 50-gp diamonds for casting chromatic orb are probably too small to be a target for someone looking for a proper resurrection, but if you got gentle repose on promptly, you only need six for revivify. That could be a tempting target for theft, if, say, you had a wizard academy or battlemage corps known to issue diamond-tipped wands.

People are less likely to have common knowledge of how gate works, but the size of its diamond component is interesting (5000gp) because while you could gather five for a true resurrection, it's overkill for anything less.

Splitting a 5kgp diamond into smaller diamonds is less economical than you probably think, because of these rules (an approximation of IRL traditional gemcutting):

The value of a gem is based on the square of its weight.
The value of a cut gem is about six times an uncut gem of the same weight.
Broken pieces of a cut gem have to be treated as uncut.
However, even a master gemcutter removes about 50% of the material when cutting a gem, so the end product in the best case is typically worth only 50% more than the raw material.
For simplicity, set a base value for which tiny gems and powder are interchangeable.

A problem you might want to consider is what justification a high level caster would have for withholding a gate diamond from use in resurrection. The most obvious argument is that if you summon an angel a few times and have them use their raise dead powers, the diamond pays for itself in a way that can be directly measured in diamonds. Although of course it's probably not desirable in your setting to allow angels to be used for cheap resurrection, perhaps it shouldn't be totally beneath them or else it's much harder to justify keeping the diamond. Maybe the problem is that they're willing to perform resurrections on request but they typically require payment in the form of noble but perilous quests.

 

[clearstream]

You have to wonder, specifically, how diamonds would be handled in the economy where their chief use is resurrection insurance. I tend to think that whatever their open market value, diamonds would be hoarded and traded at highly inflated values except perhaps in areas directly around where they are mined.

I did wonder exactly that! To start with, I feel we should assume the book price is the inflated price. That saves us supposing that a cleric must spend 600gp to obtain a 500gp diamond. If we do that, the real concern becomes supply. Where are diamond mines and who controls them? Events such as the drow invasion of Blingdenstone perhaps gain an economic axis. We might even assume that the price of peace included a deal to supply a certain weight of diamonds to market.

 

[Ovarwa]

I did wonder exactly that! To start with, I feel we should assume the book price is the inflated price. That saves us supposing that a cleric must spend 600gp to obtain a 500gp diamond. If we do that, the real concern becomes supply. Where are diamond mines and who controls them? Events such as the drow invasion of Blingdenstone perhaps gain an economic axis. We might even assume that the price of peace included a deal to supply a certain weight of diamonds to market.

RAW, the spell does not require any amount of diamonds, only a value of diamonds measured in gp. It's the price of *gold* that matters here. If diamonds become more expensive, either because diamonds are in demand or because gold has become plentiful, you need fewer of them (or lower quality)!

 

[The Crimson Binome]

RAW, the spell does not require any amount of diamonds, only a value of diamonds measured in gp. It's the price of *gold* that matters here. If diamonds become more expensive, either because diamonds are in demand or because gold has become plentiful, you need fewer of them (or lower quality)!

This point forms one of a few places where the mechanics of the game go on to suggest certain details of the setting. Because the gold value is defined as constant, but the quality of the diamond is only implied to be constant, it suggests a world where resurrection magic is rare enough that its occasional use is not enough to affect the diamond economy. The cost of the diamond needs to be entirely external to its value as a resurrection component, or else its actual quality would be irrelevant.

On the other hand, I have no problem handwaving with it and saying that a diamond is defined as being worth 500gp, just as a ruby is worth 50gp and a star sapphire is worth 200gp. It's not like we bother measuring the differences between individual gold coins or anything.

 

[Ovarwa]

Hi,

This point forms one of a few places where the mechanics of the game go on to suggest certain details of the setting. Because the gold value is defined as constant, but the quality of the diamond is only implied to be constant, it suggests a world where resurrection magic is rare enough that its occasional use is not enough to affect the diamond economy.

Or, a world in which diamonds are common enough to support an unexpectedly low cost to raise the dead!

The cost of the diamond needs to be entirely external to its value as a resurrection component, or else its actual quality would be irrelevant.

The quality can still matter. For divine magic especially, it makes sense that the value of the sacrifice matters. So a tiny gemstone or a sack of industrial-grade diamond dust both can work.

On the other hand, I have no problem handwaving with it and saying that a diamond is defined as being worth 500gp, just as a ruby is worth 50gp and a star sapphire is worth 200gp. It's not like we bother measuring the differences between individual gold coins or anything.

D&D economics and real economics are different. It's not as weirdly different as in D&D4, whose economy was just plain silly (like, I only get 20% of a magic item's value when I sell it, yet what character 5 levels lower than mine wouldn't be happy to pay me 50% of its value in a sane world?)

Anyway,

Ken

 

[The-Magic-Sword]

Hi,


Or, a world in which diamonds are common enough to support an unexpectedly low cost to raise the dead!

The quality can still matter. For divine magic especially, it makes sense that the value of the sacrifice matters. So a tiny gemstone or a sack of industrial-grade diamond dust both can work.


D&D economics and real economics are different. It's not as weirdly different as in D&D4, whose economy was just plain silly (like, I only get 20% of a magic item's value when I sell it, yet what character 5 levels lower than mine wouldn't be happy to pay me 50% of its value in a sane world?)

Anyway,

Ken

Well in 4e PC's are exceptional by the book- so whom with the kind of funds to be paying for an item like that, that isn't some kind of NPC-PC, would have a use for it? Typically it wouldn't be that useful to an army since the gold would probably be better spent on other things for the same amount of force multiplication. A collector would have you by the balls on price because of a lack of other demand.

 

[MarkB]

This point forms one of a few places where the mechanics of the game go on to suggest certain details of the setting. Because the gold value is defined as constant, but the quality of the diamond is only implied to be constant, it suggests a world where resurrection magic is rare enough that its occasional use is not enough to affect the diamond economy. The cost of the diamond needs to be entirely external to its value as a resurrection component, or else its actual quality would be irrelevant.

Unless, of course, its value is purely symbolic. A diamond for purity, and its monetary value as the amount the person requesting the service is willing to sacrifice to make it happen.

 

[The Crimson Binome]

Unless, of course, its value is purely symbolic. A diamond for purity, and its monetary value as the amount the person requesting the service is willing to sacrifice to make it happen.

Ehh... that doesn't really work, because wealth isn't actually lost when you buy something with it. The money you spend just goes back into the economy. It's not far-fetched that a jewel vendor might use the money you pay them to hire your services as an adventurer. Or you could just kill them and take the money back, which the rules would allow but which wouldn't work if you actually need to sacrifice something. To say nothing of buying diamonds from your fellow party members...

 

[MarkB]

Ehh... that doesn't really work, because wealth isn't actually lost when you buy something with it. The money you spend just goes back into the economy. It's not far-fetched that a jewel vendor might use the money you pay them to hire your services as an adventurer. Or you could just kill them and take the money back, which the rules would allow but which wouldn't work if you actually need to sacrifice something. To say nothing of buying diamonds from your fellow party members...

But you could do any of that anyway, even if you're not getting someone resurrected, and you'd be richer as a result. However you look at it, you finish the spell with one fewer diamond than you started it with, so you are giving something up, even if that something is only the time and effort required to steal a diamond.