They Changed FIREBALL?

[megamania]

I dislike 4e already.............

 

[green slime]

Hmmm, seems to me I heard something similar around eight years ago.

Then you seem to be a mite slow in posting. The discussion seems to have moved on since then...

 

[Thurbane]

The Vancian Magic System is what makes Dungeons and Dragons Dungeons and Dragons. It is a recognizable core aspect of the game that sets it apart from other RPGs. Don't like the Vancian system? Go play the dozen or so RPGs that don't use it.

Keep DnD DnD.

At the risk of getting howled down, hear hear!

 

[The Dude]

On the 33,000 cubic foot issue: if you assume that Fireball explodes in a sphere rather than as a series of cubes and do the math, you would discover that the 33,000 cubic foot area from 1e is about 20 feet in radius, the same radius from later editions.

 

[reanjr]

I'm sorry. I wasn't aware this was a humor thread until you mentioned it.

I think the advent of emoticons have ruined any critical reading of electronic correspondence. I think if you go back and read the first post carefully, you'll see that it was intended to be humorous.

 

[Charwoman Gene]

On the 33,000 cubic foot issue: if you assume that Fireball explodes in a sphere rather than as a series of cubes and do the math, you would discover that the 33,000 cubic foot area from 1e is about 20 feet in radius, the same radius from later editions.

3e doesn't expand to fill.

 

[Edena_of_Neith]

(serious)

I disagreed with even the 1st edition Fireball.
Here is a proper Fireball, regardless of the amount of damage it does:

The young lady spoke in her gentle voice, voicing syllables and wiggling fingers long and dextrious, and the point of bright red flew from fingertip across the distance to the dank, dripping way between Inn and Rooming House.

Then there was sudden light. Night turned to day. Empty air became incadescent glory. And the glory expanded, becoming a white ball, a white ball of magic incarnate and heat beyond all imagination. The ball expanded until it filled all the street between the buildings, consuming everything and everyone standing there, their forms merging with the white light and disappearing.
Against ten thousand degree heat, human flesh and the paltry protections Man affords it were of no avail. Silk and cotton evaporated, leather flashed into white ash, and mail melted into puddles of white. Magical metal, armor and weapon alike, glowed crimson as it's own magic fought to save it from the white fury.

The dull stones of the street exploded as the water within them superheated, then stone evaporated also. The white fire was unappeased, and burned deeper, gouging a great pit out of the ground, glowing a brilliant blue-white. And everything that had rested above, carts and wagons and horses and people, were all gone as if they had never been.

Such was the incredible heat contained within that white ball that radiant heat was sent forth to scorch all within hundreds of yards. Only the female wizard herself was immune, as her magic obeyed her and would not harm it's mistress.
The Inn burned as a torch would with that heat, and the rooming house walls glowed red. Windows melted away, and the heat passed through them to ignite the people exposed within. Tankards of ale boiled, casks burned and exploded, every meal was now badly overcooked, and even the hard floorboards blackened and erupted in flames.
The Rooming House had stone walls, and it's windows were shuttered by heavy iron, but the heat made the iron glow white, and the walls were close to melting, and the interior temperature of the building rose above the kindling point. Beds and clothing smoldered and burned. Inhaled air killed those who breathed it. Nearly everyone in the front half of the building was dead or dying within seconds, while those in the back half were still waking up to the colossal disaster that was befalling.

Now the white ball rose, with the grace of a hot air balloon, turning yellow as it did so, towering above the city, throwing a hellish glare for blocks around. And for blocks around, buildings were burning, people caught in the open cried out from burns or frantically rolled to put themselves out, animals with their hair burned away screamed and squealed, and some lucky few who were shielded took avantage of the confusion to make a tidy profit.
Trees were bare of leaves, the leaves evaporated or burned away, and their branches smoldered and all the bark facing the explosion was blackened. Closer to the Fireball, trees burned with the buildings. Pools of water boiled, shrubs keeled over like they had been stabbed, paint peeled away from walls, statues shattered or deformed into new and strange shapes, and the earth itself shook with the quake of the fury of the spell.

The blast wave erupted a few seconds after the main blast, and it flattened the Inn entirely, blowing the shattered wreckage into other unfortunate residences. The front of the Rooming House was crushed, and melting stone blocks shot through walls and people alike, detonating against the rear wall, tearing holes in it ... until the now unsupported roof gave way and brought every floor down. The rear wall tried to stand, valiant and unavailing, then it too went crashing down, following the roof, a mountain of glowing stone and burning wood where a five story building had once stood. Behind this ruin, the shielded building that held the smithy still stood, it's stones reflecting dully the tower of fire in front of it.
Further out, the blast shattered windows, blew out walls, overturned carts and horses alike, knocked people and tree and warping statue alike down, racing down streets for many blocks, it's force channelled and concentrated by the narrow ways. Even hundreds of feet up in the air, birds in flight were knocked out of the sky, stunned so badly by the blast they could not recover before they hit the ground.

Finally the fireball faded to dull red, now 40 feet across and hundreds of feet high, and a great cloud of smoke and flame and debris was below it and being sucked up into it, and it's light illuminated the whole of the city, reflecting brightly off the distant windows of the palace. The blast shook those windows, thousands of feet away, and disturbed the King out of his pleasures, while guards and courtiers alike looked up, wondering what had befallen and what fate it decreed for them.
The sound of the explosion was heard for many miles in all directions, a long crackling and thundering sound in the far distance. In the city, the sound was a boom and an earthquake that shook towers and great buildings alike, informing all that the fury of magic was at hand, and magic was no mere fancy.

(If you think what I have described is some sort of nuclear level explosion, think again. The explosion at Halifax (non-nuclear) was 1 kiloton. Read in your histories and see what that explosion did to Halifax. It's effects were three orders of magnitude above what I just described (Halifax was nearly completely destroyed or severely damaged.))

Now, THIS is a proper Fireball.
Remember that, the next time your character faces that cute elven girl with the gentle warm smile, the long delicate fingers, and the robes of the wizard draping her form.

 

[Varianor Abroad]

Fire pellets? Is that like owl pellets? What's inside of them? Fire mouse bones?

 

[Malhost Zormaeril]

On the 33,000 cubic foot issue: if you assume that Fireball explodes in a sphere rather than as a series of cubes and do the math, you would discover that the 33,000 cubic foot area from 1e is about 20 feet in radius, the same radius from later editions.

Sorry, (3/4 * 33,000)^(1/3) = 29,1424 (29'1.7") radius... which gives you a yardstick to measure whether 4e is "still D&D":

Is 4e Fireball weaker than 3e? If it isn't, it's not really D&D... Fireball must be nerfed every single edition!

My logic is flawless...

 

[Quasqueton]

From this thread: http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=169729

The fireball spell through the editions.

Dungeons & Dragons [original edition] (OD&D)

Fire Ball spell
A missile which springs from the finger of the Magic-User. It explodes with a burst radius of 2" (slightly larger than specified in CHAINMAIL). In a confined space the Fire Ball will generally conform to the shape of the space (elongate or whatever). The damage caused by the missile will be in proportion to the level of its user. A 6th level Magic-User throws a 6-die missile, a 7th a 7-die missile, and so on. (Note that Fire Balls from Scrolls (see Volume II) and Wand are 6-die missiles and those from Staves are 8-die missiles.

Expert Dungeons & Dragons (ED&D)

Fire Ball spell
This spell creates a missile of fire that bursts into a ball of fire 40' across (20' radius) when it strikes a target. The fire ball will do 1-6 (1d6) points of fire damage per level of the caster to each creature within the sphere of fire. EXAMPLE: A fire ball cast by a 6th level magic-user will burst for 6-36 (6d6) points of damage. If the victim of the fire ball saves vs. Spells, the spell will only do half damage.

Advanced Dungeons & Dragons [1st edition] (AD&D1)

Fireball spell
A fireball is an explosive burst of flame, which detonates with a low roar, and delivers damage proportionate to the level of the magic-user who cast it, i.e. 1 six-sided die (d6) for each level of experience of the spell caster. Exception: Magic fireball wands deliver 6 die fireballs (6d6), magic staaves with this capability deliver 8 die fireballs, and scroll spells of this type deliver a fireball of from 5 to 10 dice (d6 + 4) of damage. The burst of the fireball does not expend a considerable amount of pressure, and the burst will generally conform to the shape of the area in which it occurs, thus covering an area equal to its normal spherical volume. [The area which is covered by the fireball is a total volume of roughly 33,000 cubic feet (or yards)]. Besides causing damage to creatures, the fireball ignites all combustible materials within its burst radius, and the heat of the fireball will melt soft metals such as gold, copper, silver, etc. Items exposed to the spell's effects must be rolled for to determine if they are affected. Items with a creature which makes its saving throw are considered as unaffected. The magic-user points his or her finger and speaks the range (distance and height) at which the fireball is to burst. A streak flashes from the pointing digit and, unless it impacts upon a material body prior to attaining the prescribed range, flowers into the fireball. If creatures fail their saving throws, they all take full hit point damage from the blast. Those who make saving throws manage to dodge, fall flat or roll aside, taking 1/2 the full hit point damage --- each and every one within the blast area. The material component of this spell is a tiny ball composed of bat guano and sulphur.

Advanced Dungeons & Dragons Second Edition (AD&D2)

Fireball spell
A fireball is an explosive burst of flame, which detonates with a low roar and delivers damage proportional to the level of the wizard who cast it--1d6 points of damage for each level of experience of the spellcaster (up to a maximum of 10d6). The burst of the fireball creates little pressure and generally conforms to the shape of the area in which it occurs. The fireball fills an area equal to its normal spherical volume (roughly 33,000 cubic feet--thirty-three 10' x 10' x 10' cubes). Besides causing damage to creatures, the fireball ignites all combustible materials within its burst radius, and the heat of the fireball melts soft metals such as gold, copper, silver, etc. Exposed items require saving throws vs. magical fire to determine if they are affected, but items in the possession of a creature that rolls a successful saving throw are unaffected by the fireball.

The wizard points his finger and speaks the range (distance and height) at which the fireball is to burst. A streak flashes from the pointing digit and, unless it impacts upon a material body or solid barrier prior to attaining the prescribed range, blossoms into the fireball (an early impact results in an early detonation). Creatures failing their saving throws each suffer full damage from the blast. Those who roll successful saving throws manage to dodge, fall flat, or roll aside, each receiving half damage (the DM rolls the damage and each affected creature suffers either full damage or half damage [round fractions down], depending on whether the creature saved or not).

The material component of this spell is a tiny ball of bat guano and sulphur.

Dungeons & Dragons [3rd edition] (D&D3)

Fireball spell
A fireball spell is an explosion of flame that detonates with a low roar and deals 1d6 points of fire damage per caster level (maximum 10d6) to every creature within the area. Unattended objects also take this damage. The explosion creates almost no pressure.

You point your finger and determine the range (distance and height) at which the fireball is to burst. A glowing, pea-sized bead streaks from the pointing digit and, unless it impacts upon a material body or solid barrier prior to attaining the prescribed range, blossoms into the fireball at that point. (An early impact results in an early detonation.) If you attempt to send the bead through a narrow passage, such as through and arrow slit, you must "hit" the opening with a ranged touch attack, or else the bead strikes the barrier and detonates permaturely.

The fireball sets fire to combustables and damage objects in the area. It can melt metals with low melting points, such as lead, gold, copper, silver, and bronze. If the damage caused to an interposing barrier shatters or breaks through it, the fireball may continue beyond the barrier if the area permits; otherwise it stops at the barrier just as any other spell effect does.

Material Component: A tiny ball of bat guano and sulfur.

Quasqueton