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Reynard

Legend
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Superman stood by and let his father die.
this is a legitimate complaint. It was bad writing.
Superman did basically nothing to save the civilians during the fight with Zod.
This is one of Kal's classic learning moments. It cones up again and again.
Superman murders Zod.
Yes, and then realizes that he should never allow himself to be in that position again.


Anyone who gave a damn about the character or knew what the superhero genre was about would never let those things happen.
It seems to me that you want Kal to be perfect and not have to learn how to be the paragon he becomes. I find that boring and bad storytelling.

But, hey, unpopular opinions, right?
 

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overgeeked

B/X Known World
this is a legitimate complaint. It was bad writing.

This is one of Kal's classic learning moments. It cones up again and again.

Yes, and then realizes that he should never allow himself to be in that position again.

It seems to me that you want Kal to be perfect and not have to learn how to be the paragon he becomes. I find that boring and bad storytelling.

But, hey, unpopular opinions, right?
Any time Superman is not a perfect paragon is bad portrayals? No thank you.
You can make him less than perfect without undermining the core of the character and the genre. That’s just bad writing.
 


overgeeked

B/X Known World
Take those three scenes and fix them to still have impact, perhaps even more impact, without undercutting the character and the genre.

Superman stood by and let his father die. Clark would never let his father die and he's Superman, so he can save anyone from anything as long as he's close enough and knows it's going on. Clear example of the character being ridiculously overpowered and therefore hard to write well. But, this is also exactly why Pa Kent is (almost) always shown as having a heart attack and dying of natural causes. If there's some threat, Supes can always just save him. Boring. So Pa dies of natural causes. Nothing Supes can do about the normal human lifespan. This is a clear example of Chesterton's Fence. The writers wanted to make it their own and failed to understand why it was done this way for so long. Hell, you could even have Pa Kent raise his hand to say "no" only for Clark to do it anyway, then have Pa drop dead from the heart attack. Barely have to change the scene. And you don't undercut the core of the character.

Superman did basically nothing to save the civilians during the fight with Zod. Yep, this is a classic learning moment for a young Superman. But what's learned? "People die if I don't act." Okay. Is there a better way to convey that without undermining the character? You betcha. Maybe hundreds of 'em. Here's a good one: the old standby of the try-fail cycle. You have Superman, the ur-superhero...gasp...actually trying to save people. Wild concept, I know. But...you have him fail a few times. Try-fail. Emphasis on the try part. Which sets up a classic example of the villain using Superman's caring for the civilians to torture and taunt him. Zod endangers the civvies, Supes try-fail cycles through a few buildings worth of civilians, finally saves some of them in a panic, Zod notices so targets the civvies even more, Supes in now frantically on the hook and desperate to save people. Like he should...because he's a damned superhero. You have him learn the exact same lesson without undermining the character's core.

Superman murders Zod. The Phantom Zone is literally right there. "But in the movie..." Yes, in the badly written movie they did something dumb so couldn't or wouldn't use the Phantom Zone. So don't make that mistake in the first place. Zod lives, Superman now has a long-term nemesis trapped in another dimension looking for revenge. You know, instead of Superman, Kal-El, the Last Son of Krypton, being a murdering anti-hero.

Took longer to type that than think about it. I'd watch that movie a few more times. Huge fan of superheroes and I don't really even like Superman. He's boring. But undermining him is not the way to refresh the character.
 


Haiku Elvis

Knuckle-dusters, glass jaws and wooden hearts.
It is not a DCEU movie, which I think was the real question. That said, Zack Snyder's Randian worldview, which he carried over to his DCEU movies, is all over Watchmen. (I would say the HBO Watchmen series understood the core text better than Snyder did, though.)

Otherwise, Dark Knight is the best DC movie, with Superman II close on its heels.
I would have agreed with Superman II until I watched it again a few years ago. It was clear they were pushing the limits of the special effects for the time and they don't hold up well compared to the original. Also I felt the story/script hadn't held up but I can't remember details. I think some of the comedy moments may not have not aged well. I just remember being very disappointed with it as it was my favourite as a kid.
I didn't say it wasn't creepy and gross. It's still a better film and story, disturbing as it is. I've watched many of the DC cinematic films, they're mostly terrible. The best of them is not better than the worst of the DC animated stuff. Hell, the Teen Titans vs Teen Titans Go movie was better than anything they did live action.
Teen Titans Go to the Movies is the best DC movie. Teen Titans Go generally is the best of DC apart from...
The best DC movie is Batman. The 1966 version.
Actually the 2016 sequel Batman: the Return of the caped crusaders is even better. Made just before Adam West died.
 

Cadence

Legend
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Teen Titans Go to the Movies is the best DC movie. Teen Titans Go generally is the best of DC apart from...

Actually the 2016 sequel Batman: the Return of the caped crusaders is even better. Made just before Adam West died.

We really enjoyed Lego Batman as a family. (Related family that is, but not that that's better than with friends, since...)
 

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