Vampire and Werewolf PC's

[papa_laz]

Sorry if this is in one of the core rulebooks but I couldnt find it anywehere.

Im going to be playing in a campaign in which will be a vampire PC and a werewolf PC but im not sure what their CR should be. The party will be 10th level so how many levels will need to be taken off the classes of these players to make them equal to a standard 10th level character.

Thanks for your help.

 

[Xarlen]

Werewolf ECL is +3. I've had a Natural Werewolf in my party for about four levels now, and they seem pretty balanced with the party.

Of course, she's a Fighter/Ranger focusing on Two Weapon Fighting, so there is certain bonuses...

 

[Oni]

Curiousity question. How are you guys planning on handling the inherent limitations that come with vampiric weaknesses?

 

[Xarlen]

Curiousity question. How are you guys planning on handling the inherent limitations that come with vampiric weaknesses?

Likely with a dustpan.

 

[papa_laz]

We just wont be going out in the day time. Know the ECL for vampires anyone?

 

[Xarlen]

I don't think 10th level is gunna do it.

The character has to atleast be 5th level. And the Vampire template is not a +5 ECl, let me tell you. They can dominate, All Day Long.

 

[papa_laz]

They do seem very powerful, but why do they need to be a minimum of 5th level to use the template?

In the MM it says the CR is base creature +2 which dosent seem anywhere near powerful enough.

 

[Hypersmurf]

They do seem very powerful, but why do they need to be a minimum of 5th level to use the template?

Create Spawn (Su): A humanoid or monstrous humanoid slain by a vampire’s energy drain attack rises as a vampire spawn 1d4 days after burial. If the vampire instead drains the victim’s Constitution to 0 or less, the victim returns as a spawn if it had 4 or fewer HD and as a vampire if it had 5 or more HD. In either case, the new vampire or spawn is under the command of the vampire that created it and remains enslaved until its master’s death.

There isn't really any way to get a Vampire with less than 5 hit dice... and for most people, hit dice = character levels...

In the MM it says the CR is base creature +2 which dosent seem anywhere near powerful enough.

Remember, there's a big difference between CR modifier and ECL modifier sometimes.

-Hyp.

 

[Oni]

It says in the template itself that a character must be fifth level to become a vampire, lower than that and they just become vampire spawn (which one option you might explore, a vampire spawn and then take levels from there as it is a creature and not a template. Though it is probably still poor for a PC.

I know it isn't exactly what your looking for, but I have a PrC I made that might work for the character in question. It is for a Dhampir, but it wouldn't be hard to say that it was a full blooded vamp either.

[edit: oh yeah, just for the record, I think the vampire templates CR modifier is terribly low]

 

[Xarlen]

I don't know, Oni. 3 6th level PCs took out a CR 9 vampire. Then again, he was a Dwarven fighter who didn't have full wealth options... Hrm.

But remember, CR!=ECL.

Look at the Fiendish Template. Up to 3 HD, no CR adjustment. 4-7 HD +1 adjustment. 8+ +2 adjustment.

Let's look at what a Fiendish creature gets.

Smite Good. Darkvision. SR Double it's HD. Fire and Cold res. Damage Reduction.

Would you let a PC have all this, for a set +1, or +2 ECL? That goes up As they level?