Vorpal Crits

[Caliban]

Isn't there a fourth option? I could have sworn I'd seen folk in this thread arguing that, while you took the maximum result on the weapon dice, you rolled them anyway, simply to check to see if they exploded.

That is to say, you roll the weapon damage, replace it with max damage, and reroll any dice from the roll you skipped if they showed max, even though you didn't need to use them.

While the rules support for this option is weak, it seems to preserve the relationship between a regular hit and a crit nicely, without accidentally causing infinite plus 6d12 damage.

--
gnfnrf

If you don't like how I worded the question, feel free to send a question in yourself.

 

[gnfnrf]

If you don't like how I worded the question, feel free to send a question in yourself.

I didn't mean to impugn your question writing ability. In fact, I appreciated that, after nineteen pages of debate, you spelled out the positions clearly. I just wanted to make sure that here in the record of this thread, all of the positions were recapped.

Of course, I'm not even sure anyone else suggested that. The debate got pretty esoteric.

--
gnfnrf

 

[Lurker37]

Thanks for the info Lurker, for now, it would appear that CServ has some internal clarifications needed. BTW, can you post what you asked CServ?

Edited into my original post, but here it is again.

If you score a critical hit with a Vorpal Weapon (+6), and due to the critical hit take all weapon dice as if they had rolled maximum, do those automatically maximised weapon dice get rerolled due to the 'reroll on maximum' property of the vorpal weapon, or does the fact that the dice were not physically rolled mean it does not apply?

Do any of the weapon's 'critical: +6d12' dice get rerolled if they come up maximum?

Do the +3d12 dice from the daily power get rerolled on a natural 12? Do they get maximised on a crit?

Does the Vorpal property allow effects like Hunter's Mark to be rerolled on a maximum? Does this apply on a crit?

Hmm. On re-reading it maybe I didn't quite aim the question at my biggest problem - the disparity between this and the rules on page 276.

Until something else from CServ comes out or errata, looks like the rolls not being rolls but yet counting as rolls school of thought is the current answer.

Yes, this way of putting it is why I am among those surprised by the answer. The concept of what is and is not considered a roll just became a little more difficult for me to wrap my head around. No matter which way I look at it there's a general inconsistency that bothers me, and I'm worried about encountering more of this sort of contradiction as more powers and items are released.

 

[hong]

Onwards to page 20!

Quick, there's only a few more hours!

 

[hong]

Yes, this way of putting it is why I am among those surprised by the answer. The concept of what is and is not considered a roll just became a little more difficult for me to wrap my head around. No matter which way I look at it there's a general inconsistency that bothers me, and I'm worried about encountering more of this sort of contradiction as more powers and items are released.

A crit is a maximised roll.

It really is that simple. The conniptions come in trying to turn plain language into legalese.

 

[DLichen]

A crit is a maximised roll.

It really is that simple. The conniptions come in trying to turn plain language into legalese.

No, it is not, the least you could do is not spread misinformation.

The only backing to that statement is the half-assed legalese. If you take everything at face value, what you suggest still won't work.

 

[Caliban]

No, it is not, the least you could do is not spread misinformation.

The only backing to that statement is the half-assed legalese. If you take everything at face value, what you suggest still won't work.

I don't think it's fair to accuse Hong of trying to spread misinformation (at least, not in the rules forum).

I think he honestly believes what he is saying. Last night I said I couldn't understand his arguement, but after sleeping on it, I think I understand his point of view better. (I still disagree with him, but I think I understand how he came to his conclusion.)

 

[hong]

Yay! Page 20!

 

[Caliban]

Yay! Page 20!

Your childish glee touches my bitter black heart.

Stop it.

 

[Caliban]

I received a response from WOTC Customer service (to add to the ones we already have).

Thank you for contacting us. Explanation # 2 is the most accurate. For this example we will use a +6 Vorpal Longsword. When I score a critical hit using this weapon, I will not be rolling damage, I will just determine the maximum damage I could roll with my attack. This alone does not trigger the Vorpal Property. However Because I scored a critical hit I need to roll 1d12 for every plus my weapon has. This is extra damage so it is not automatically maximized. Since my sword is + 6, I will roll 6d12. If I roll a 12 on any of these dice, this will trigger the Vorpal property, and you will rereoll the dice that rolled 12, so on and so forth. I hope this information is useful.

Good Gaming!


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