Want To See The Castle Ravenloft Poster Map In CURSE OF STRAHD?

Those who are excited about the fold-out map in Curse of Strahd can take a peek at it courtesy of Jeremy Crawford. The map features Barovia on one side, and Castle Ravenloft on the other, depicted in a gorgeous isometric view just like the original Ravenloft module was back in 1983.

 

[GX.Sigma]

It's actually exactly the same as the original map from the 80s.

That's what I'm saying. Adventure design has stagnated so much that the best thing in this book is a reprint of a 33-year-old map. They didn't improve it or next-level it in any way; they just hit copy and paste. I appreciate the respect for the original work, but they could've tried to do "Ravenloft improved." Instead, it just looks like they're doing "Ravenloft again," plus enough filler to reach their mandated page count. If I wanted an exact copy of I6, I'd just buy a copy of I6. The original module had a lot of great ideas, but why don't they try to come up with some new great ideas?

It seems like they thought I6 was 100% perfect (which is obviously false), and that there was no way they could do any better than that (which is apparently true). It's cheap and safe. They're not trying to achieve something truly great and advance the state of the art; they're just cashing in on a property they already own, where all the creativity has already been done for them. Like Hollywood.

Of course, this is just my opinion based on what they've revealed so far. I'll eat my words if the rest of the adventure has any great, original, innovative ideas (from this century).

I've already pre-ordered it, and I'm sure I'll get value out of it (because, hey, 5e Ravenloft), but I expect this'll be my last WotC purchase for quite a while.

 

[The Human Target]

Why do you say that?

They are attractive to look at but their in game use is negligible.

 

[AaronOfBarbaria]

Adventure design has stagnated so much that the best thing in this book is a reprint of a 33-year-old map.

So you got an advanced copy how, exactly?

They didn't improve it or next-level it in any way; they just hit copy and paste.

The map? Yes. Same castle, same map. The adventure? Seems very unlikely - but unlike you obviously have in order to make your comments make any sense at all, I haven't read the adventure yet.

Edit to clarify: I realize of course that you've already admitted to not having actually read the adventure - my point is that damning the adventure as "copy and paste" because the map is same is ridiculous when considering that it is meant to be the same castle as it has always been.

I mean, you wouldn't expect the layout of Waterdeep to keep getting re-designed every time an adventure takes place there, right?

 

[dave2008]

Of course, this is just my opinion based on what they've revealed so far. I'll eat my words if the rest of the adventure has any great, original, innovative ideas (from this century).

Why not just wait until the adventure comes out? And what would be a great, original, innovative idea? Can you give an example from a recent product (non-WotC I assume)?

Personally I don't run published adventures, but if I did all I would want would is something fun for my group.

 

[MrHotter]

That's what I'm saying. Adventure design has stagnated so much that the best thing in this book is a reprint of a 33-year-old map. They didn't improve it or next-level it in any way; they just hit copy and paste. I appreciate the respect for the original work, but they could've tried to do "Ravenloft improved." Instead, it just looks like they're doing "Ravenloft again," plus enough filler to reach their mandated page count. If I wanted an exact copy of I6, I'd just buy a copy of I6. The original module had a lot of great ideas, but why don't they try to come up with some new great ideas?

It seems like they thought I6 was 100% perfect (which is obviously false), and that there was no way they could do any better than that (which is apparently true). It's cheap and safe. They're not trying to achieve something truly great and advance the state of the art; they're just cashing in on a property they already own, where all the creativity has already been done for them. Like Hollywood.

Of course, this is just my opinion based on what they've revealed so far. I'll eat my words if the rest of the adventure has any great, original, innovative ideas (from this century).

I've already pre-ordered it, and I'm sure I'll get value out of it (because, hey, 5e Ravenloft), but I expect this'll be my last WotC purchase for quite a while.

I'm glad this is an updated I6. I was about to run I6 for my family game, but the monsters and treasure conversions were just not working out right. The map was also hard to read in the first module. There were places where you could not tell where a wall was, so a redrawing will come in handy.

Since this module added enough to go from 1-10 I may have to make new characters or start halfway into the module.

If you check out the table of contents you can also see that the floor maps are also in the book (top down) so the isometric one will come in handy when changing floors, and the ones in the book will help if we want to draw the rooms at the table.

 

[DEFCON 1]

I've already pre-ordered it, and I'm sure I'll get value out of it (because, hey, 5e Ravenloft), but I expect this'll be my last WotC purchase for quite a while.

Wait a minute... so you're already pre-ordered and expect to get value out of a product you already believe to be nothing more than a cut and paste job...

...but you then WON'T buy a potential next product because of it, despite the fact that THAT ONE might actually be the original idea you are looking for?

That makes ABSOLUTELY NO SENSE. The lack of logic in this is just baffling.

 

[ccs]

They are attractive to look at but their in game use is negligible.

Really? So do you have a better idea of how to:
Determine what the castle looks like?
To tell where pcs/npcs etc are in the castle?
How about to invoke a visual feel for the module?

 

[Psikerlord#]

I like the map, very cool

 

[GX.Sigma]

my point is that damning the adventure as "copy and paste" because the map is same is ridiculous when considering that it is meant to be the same castle as it has always been.

I mean, you wouldn't expect the layout of Waterdeep to keep getting re-designed every time an adventure takes place there, right?

I'm not damning the entire adventure as copy and paste, just the map. Calling it "the best thing in the book" was a mistake on my part. Obviously, having seen the table of contents, there is some new stuff in the book that we haven't seen yet.

To clarify, it's still a great map, and I didn't really expect them to change it. I'm just saying it's the best thing we've seen so far, and that that sucks, because it implies they haven't really advanced since 1983. Just look at Death House next to this. Notice how there's a sidebar telling you how high all the ceilings are, when that information could easily be on the map itself (like it is on the Ravenloft map)? Really basic stuff like that.

Why not just wait until the adventure comes out?

I intend to post a full review after the adventure comes out.

And what would be a great, original, innovative idea? Can you give an example from a recent product (non-WotC I assume)?

They are few and far between. (Note to self: read more indie D&D stuff.) Off the top of my head, Vornheim has some good stuff that actually helps the DM run the game more easily. Die drop tables are great, original, and innovative. Also, not really "original" anymore (but great and innovative): some adventures actually have the map and key on the same page, or a two-page spread, so you don't have to memorize a huge wall of text, flip back and forth, etc. That's a good step forward.

I'm glad this is an updated I6. I was about to run I6 for my family game, but the monsters and treasure conversions were just not working out right. The map was also hard to read in the first module. There were places where you could not tell where a wall was, so a redrawing will come in handy.

I appreciate an updated classic as well (that's why I bought it), but this is 10x the price of the original. Is it worth it? It remains to be seen.

If you check out the table of contents you can also see that the floor maps are also in the book (top down) so the isometric one will come in handy when changing floors, and the ones in the book will help if we want to draw the rooms at the table.

Do we know they're top down? If so, that's nice. The 3e remake did that too, so I appreciate it not being a strict downgrade.

Wait a minute... so you're already pre-ordered and expect to get value out of a product you already believe to be nothing more than a cut and paste job...

See above. (Also: yes I'm going to get some value out of it, but will it be worth the $50, considering I already have the original?)

...but you then WON'T buy a potential next product because of it, despite the fact that THAT ONE might actually be the original idea you are looking for?

That makes ABSOLUTELY NO SENSE. The lack of logic in this is just baffling.

I never said I'm going to boycott all future WotC products sight-unseen. That would be insane. I'm just not going to buy something from them unless I'm convinced it's worth it to me, which (at this time) seems unlikely to happen in the near future.

 

[dave2008]

To clarify, it's still a great map, and I didn't really expect them to change it. I'm just saying it's the best thing we've seen so far, and that that sucks, because it implies they haven't really advanced since 1983. Just look at Death House next to this. Notice how there's a sidebar telling you how high all the ceilings are, when that information could easily be on the map itself (like it is on the Ravenloft map)? Really basic stuff like that.

I've heard a lot of good things about Death House - what do you find lacking? The lack of ceiling height on a floor map notwithstanding.

I intend to post a full review after the adventure comes out.

Cool - I look forward to it.

They are few and far between. (Note to self: read more indie D&D stuff.) Off the top of my head, Vornheim has some good stuff that actually helps the DM run the game more easily. Die drop tables are great, original, and innovative. Also, not really "original" anymore (but great and innovative): some adventures actually have the map and key on the same page, or a two-page spread, so you don't have to memorize a huge wall of text, flip back and forth, etc. That's a good step forward.

Hmm, not a lot to chew on. What are die drop tables? All you want is better maps?