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[Way OT & possibly NC-17 rated] Can men and women "just be friends"?

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Stalker0

Legend
Well I have some current experience with this so I'll give in my two bits. My girlfriend of just a year and a half just broke up with and started dating another guy. However, I can probably talk to her about deeper stuff than I can with anyone else, and she with me, so we've stayed friends.

Its been a month now, and its been damn hard. Sometimes it doesn't seem like anything's changed, and sometimes I can see how its completely different. I'm still very attracted to her, and I think she still has feelings for me too. Its hard in that situation, because in some ways you hope that maybe if your still there things will go back to how they used to be, and at the same time you don't want to feel strung along or used.

So in that situation, I don't think I can ever treat as just another friend. In some ways I will always treat her better than a friend, and in some ways I can never do the things I would do with a friend. I guess I'll see if that changes as time goes by.
 

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The Sigil

Mr. 3000 (Words per post)
KDLadage said:
To: The Sigil
From: KDLadage
Subj: Thread Future

Personally, I feel that there are several interesting and civil discussions taking place within this thread. No need to close the thread just yet.

Thanks.
No problem. I will bow out of the thread at this point as I really don't have much more to add anyway - I've said everything I think is relevant, hence there is little use for my continued posting to the thread - I'll just wind up beating the same horse ;).

--The Sigil
Iconic Curmudgeon ;)
 


LazarusLong42

First Post
Arg. Every fiber of my being tells me to stay away, 'cause I'll either (1) get sucked in or (2) get emotionally worked up, or (3) offend someone. But the first two are my own lookout, and for the third... well, I'll just hope I roll high on Diplomacy...

As the base for my thoughts, a few things: I am male; I am straight; I am in a committed, long-term relationship (the wedding's 4 October!); and despite all that, emotionally, I often gender-identify as female.

Most of my friends are female. Two out of three of my groomsmen are female. Some of these female friends I have been attracted to. Some of them I have flirted with--and some of them I still do, depending on your definition of "flirting." By said same definition, though, I also flirt with my best man, who is another straight male.

Part of the problem is that there are several words in this thread--"love," "friend," "flirt," "gender"--that cannot be adequately defined by the board as a group, because each person must define them himself or herself. "Love," to me, is sacred, but also available freely to more than just those whom I "shag" (a word which can, I think, be adequately defined). I love my friends, and while some would say "like sisters and brothers," I would say, "No, like friends." I love my sister quite differently.

"Friend" is more difficult to define, even individually. Like many others, I have varying levels of friendship, from people who know my absolute deepest secrets to people who I'll say "hi" to on the street.

"Gender" is even more difficult for me to define, and this is where some might be offended--but keep in mind this is only my opinion/feeling. I do not divide humans into two genders; I divide them into three. There are the "typical males" and "typical females," who together make up 80-90% of the populace. And then there are the rest of us--and probably most gamers fall into this category. These are the people who do not manifest stereotypical qualities of either gender--or manifest qualities of both. The sensitive males, the women who are willing to not be annoyed at sports, the people of both gender who are less concerned with their appearances, hormones, and possessions and more concerned with their health, personal morality and, most important, minds--these people all fall into that last category.

All of my friends fall into that last category. They are neither female nor male in my mind, except in the sense that some of them have different bits than others.

So, I guess the initial question was "Can men and women be friends?" I'll assume that the question covers biological men and women, rather than my categorization. And the answer is an unconditional yes.

Can they be friends without being sexually attracted? Certainly. Can they be friends, be sexually attracted, not have anything happen, and still remain friends? Absolutely.

Can they be friends without flirting? Does it matter? Flirting is harmless, and to my mind at least, there's no difference between minor flirting between me and one of my female friends, football players slapping each other on the back, and women gossiping at the beauty parlor.

Can they be friends even after being in a relationship that is "friendship with fringe benefits"? Of course, assuming the breakup is amicable and mutual (and before you ask, while I've never been through said sort of breakup, I've seen several sets of friends do so and remain friends with each other).

Am I unusual? Bizarre? Probably. :) And I've got no problem with that.

Well. That was anything but concise. Thanks for reading.
 

Uzumaki

First Post
alsih2o said:
sex is a basic drive, just like hunger.

Wrong. You need food to live. You don't need sex to live. I've said before, I'm asexual. I lack interest in sex, period. I'm 19, folks. Right in the middle of raging hormone territory. It's just never been an issue. I've had a hell of a lot of male and female friends and not a damn one has ever been anything more than purely friends with me. We can all sleep together in the same house and no one has any wet bedsheets in the morning. Some of us even crash in the same room, the same bed. Nothing but sleeping.

I know I'm an extreme on the sexual scale, but even before I indentified myself as being a total asexual (we've all known each other for 5 years, more or less, and I came out of the asexual closet a few months ago), there just wasn't any sexual rapport between us.

So, yes, men and women can be just friends. I'm the only asexual one, and there have been many a tiff between one or more of them about who's dating who, but our interactions don't exude sexual tension, because we're just not attracted to each that way.
 

takyris

First Post
I think that people here have radically different concepts of friendship.

1) My friendships with all my guy friends are not the same. Some of my guy friends are good for talking about computers or gaming with, but I wouldn't go into a lot of detail about emotional issues or the state of my marital relations with the wife. Some guys, I'd feel much more comfortable talking about emotions and sex and all of that. Therefore, I can't just say, "With guys I am BLANK. With gals I am OTHERBLANK." Anyone who treats all of his friends the same way has a very simplistic view of people.

2) There are a ton of different levels for friendship. What many people here are calling friendship, I'd call "acquaintanceship". I consider myself to have a great many acquaintances, and a few very close friends. Even when single, I wouldn't really make the moves on acquaintances. And once we were very close friends for a long time, it was as though some kind of inertia had settled in, and neither of us made the "try dating" move because we were comfortable where we were. So, were I single, I might try to take things to the next level with a female friend, but it would definitely be a certain level of friendship -- not just an acquaintance, and probably not a "friends since we were six" lifelong friend.

3) Attempting to repress feelings of sexual attraction for someone is a great way to have them burst out fantastically at exactly the wrong moment. If you have an attraction to a friend and know that they don't feel the same thing, or that other situations would make that attraction unworkable in reality, then you face that attraction, admit it, and deny it its "monster under the bed" power over you. Then you act normally around her.

-Tacky
 

Mathew_Freeman

First Post
RigaMortis - I think that when I said you were putting words in my mouth, I meant that you were assuming that I shared the same definitions of those words, which is not the case. Sorry about that, my bad.

Several people have expressed my viewpoint on this topic...so I don't think I have any more to say.

Can a man and a woman be just friends? I say yes. And I agree that you need to take each friendship as an individual thing.

Beyond that, it all gets very complicated, as this thread as shown.

But I'm going to carry on reading this thread, and see what happens!
 

Jenale

First Post
I guess it never really occurred to me that I couldn't be friends with guys without it having to take on potential sexual overtones--I mean, never once while playing (back in my high school days when all of us were officially unattached) did it occur to me that the guys I played with weren't a bunch of good friends. Of course, nowadays, I'm married with four kids (and believe it or not, my husband doesn't care for role-playing though I say it's only because the first experience was ruined by an idiot DM).
 

While I'll admit that men being friends with women and men being friends with other men are different, I do think that it is possible. Can it be without ever THINKING of sex or flirting? That makes it more difficult, but if you include those things sure.

And why should it be the same? Men and women ARE different. The brains are even different. My dog was one of my best friends, but the relationship with my other friends are different... heck they are all different between each guy.

*shrug*
 

boothbey

First Post
EricNoah said:


If I like a girl, and I'm also attracted to her, that doesn't mean I'm "pretending" to be her friend. I think you can *actually* be friends even in that situation. I hope you don't take offense, but the thought of a guy "pretending" to be friends with a girl in order to make a move on her is kinda ... creepy. I guess it happens, though. Maybe that's not what you meant...

In my situtation, I was friends with the girl before becoming attracted to her. Those feelings have deepened into a great love for her. Even though she does not feel the same, that in no way makes her any less a friend. I have never pretended about anything in regards to our relationship and have been completely open about my feelings--both good and bad.

More than just creepy, pretending to be a friend to make a move is mean and rather gutless. If you are friends already and then "make a move" that is at least being true to yourself and her/him.

Certainly men and women can be just friends. And they can certainly be friends when one wants more than just friendship from the other, it is just harder.
 

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