What 4e Products are worth getting for a Non-4e Gamers

[amerigoV]

In the d20 resurrected thread,

Does 4E count?

I've been meaning to ask, so here it goes:

I was a big 3.x junkie that moved on to Savage Worlds. But I still pine to throw a few bucks the way of the Wizards if the product has some value. 4e is an easy convert to SW (especially monsters), thus quality products are worth getting even if I do not play 4e.

So lets hear it, what products are worth getting under 4e for someone who has a large 3e collection? Obviously the PHBn and player option books are not since they are all player crunch. Pure monster books are not of that much value since I have most of the MMs from 3e.

I've got most of the Eberron and FR materials from 3e, so I would only be looking for something new there. I did pick up Dark Sun as I never played it the first time around. I'll admit the 20 some pages of player crunch in the early/middle of the book kinda put me off, but I'll give it another crack since I love the concept.

Are any of the modules worth getting? Any instant classics out there? Any other products with great ideas and light on player crunch?

 

[Aplus]

Every 4E product (at least the ones put out by WotC) that I have read or used has been 90% or more crunch. If you are looking for flavor/fluff, I can't say that WotC has anything to offer. The only WotC products worth buying (just my opinion of course) are the minis, which you have to buy in the secondary market anyways unless you want to deal with randomness.

I am considering getting the new Gamma World, as I've heard good things about that, but I'm not sure if that fits what you are looking for.

If you are interested in setting material, my recommendation would be Paizo. I've found the plots/places easy to convert to other systems, although for the most part we use them with the system they were written for. If you want to get a feel for what the setting is like without having to buy something first, their free web fiction is a good way to do that.

Hope that is helpful!

 

[Mercurius]

The Eberron Campaign Guide is an overall better treatment of the setting than the 3.x version, imo. But I don't think it is a "must have" for you.

I'm not sure that any 4E product would really suit your purposes, at least not until (and if) they come out with a new setting. All of the "theme books" have lots of fluff, but a lot of it would probably be familiar to you (Open Grave, Demonomicon, the two Draconomicons, Underdark).

If you are interested in 4E's new planar cosmology you might want to check out Manual of the Planes, The Plane Above, and The Plane Below.

Also, it hasn't come out yet but you might want to check out the Shadowfell box set as it looks to be an interesting hybrid of Ravenloft and the Shadowfell. Also, The Madness of Gardmore Abbey--a mega-adventure centered on the Deck of Many Things--has potential.

Now if you're looking beyond WotC, I would recommend Deus Ex Machina's Amethyst: Foundations book. Great art, fun idea, lots to enjoy purely from an armchair perspective. But afaik, there haven't been many 3PP jewels.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

It depends upon exactly what you're looking to do with them. Personally, I find the books with character class info- feats, powers, etc.- to be the most useful, since both players and GMs can use them.

 

[Voadam]

I've heard good things about Underdark, particularly its treatment of the new 4e insane underdark prison god Torog who was physically crippled and mentally unhinged in the fight against Tharizdun and his continuing role as the warden of the big T's chains.

Similarly for the Dragonomicons, the Demonomicon, and Open Grave, the in-depth undead fluff book. Supposedly great descriptive stuff in them in addition to 4e stat blocks.

I recently got a cheap used copy of Manual of the Planes. I was excited to see what they did with Grazzt as a crossover devil turned demon lore. While the information on Grazzt is evocative and fantastic it is like a single paragraph of description and then the stat block for him, his aspect, and some of his cultists.

The Divine Power book supposedly had some stuff on the primodial/divine war and the Primal Power Book has stuff on spirits plus PH3 has a fun description of psionics as a natural world reaction against far realms intrusion, but these are majority crunch books.

The two preview books about races and classes and worlds and monsters might be useful as mostly description stuff.

 

[amerigoV]

I am considering getting the new Gamma World, as I've heard good things about that, but I'm not sure if that fits what you are looking for.

I've thought about GW - it looks like a fun change of pace type game. Plus someone already Savaged it - so I could play it either in the native system or SW.

The planar material might be useful to others, but I have always use planes as "seasoning" vs. a main course. Its sounds like other items might have some gems, but not be all that different for ideas (Draconomicon for example). I am reluctant to pony up $30+ for just a gem or two.

Anything on the adventure front? I have Shadowfell (meh) and Tomb of Horrors (the expanded book, not the 4e of the classic) but I have only glanced at ToH so far.

 

[MerricB]

Tomb of Horrors is awesome. It's split into four connected parts: you run the first adventure, then the second adventure a few levels later, etc.

There's a lot of thinking adventurer's puzzles in it, as well as some interesting combats. I've got session reports of our first two sessions here and here.

Of the adventures, P2: Demon Queen's Enclave was very enjoyable: it's a lot more freeform than most 4E adventures, and there's competing factions and the like to interact with.

Cheers!

 

[Mercurius]

I'll second Tomb of Horrors. I only ran the first chapter but it was quite enjoyable - very challenging (two PCs died, killed by the gray angels).

 

[Steel_Wind]

Apart from minis, I would also point out that the Dungeon Tiles, 4E branded, are quite nice and if you are so inclined, multiple packs of those will find a use at any gamer's table.

 

[amerigoV]

Apart from minis, I would also point out that the Dungeon Tiles, 4E branded, are quite nice and if you are so inclined, multiple packs of those will find a use at any gamer's table.

I keep going back and forth if I will be a minis guy or a VTT guy. I use both, depending on my mood and circumstance. I'll consider picking up some of the tiles.


I'll have to check out P2: Demon Queen's Enclave. I like the shared experience of modules.