What happened to Morale?

[77IM]

I think what the game needs is quick and abstract "flee from combat" rules, to make retreat a viable option. As it stands, retreating is basically a suicide option against most player groups, who are trained from years of video games to kill everything and hope that XP orbs pop out.

At my table, if you reach the edge of the battle map, you can use your action to successfully flee. It doesn't matter who has the faster movement speed or longer attack range or whatever. We use a pretty big map, so if a creature manages to get to the edge, it's just no longer worth worrying about that stuff. This works for both PCs and NPCs.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

I unusually award the same xp if monsters flee as if they are killed.


I've never used morale rules, and I have been playing since 1st edition. It's up to the DM to role-play when monsters flee, and up to the players to role-play when their characters flee.

 

[Ancalagon]

I unusually award the same xp if monsters flee as if they are killed.


I've never used morale rules, and I have been playing since 1st edition. It's up to the DM to role-play when monsters flee, and up to the players to role-play when their characters flee.

Is it up to the DM to roleplay (ie, decide) if a monster hits or miss, or makes a save? If you roll for those, why not for morale? In a way it's more "fair" , the dice have spoken

 

[cmad1977]

Is it up to the DM to roleplay (ie, decide) if a monster hits or miss, or makes a save? If you roll for those, why not for morale? In a way it's more "fair" , the dice have spoken

Because NPCs don’t behave randomly. They have goals and motivations that aren’t determined by a random die roll. From the Evil Lich Lord to the random Giant spider, all NPCs have a reason for being there and their goals determine their behavior in dire situations.

Morale rules are extra dice and tables that are completely unnecessary. They’re fine and all. Just not necessary.

 

[Ancalagon]

Because NPCs don’t behave randomly. They have goals and motivations that aren’t determined by a random die roll. From the Evil Lich Lord to the random Giant spider, all NPCs have a reason for being there and their goals determine their behavior in dire situations.

Morale rules are extra dice and tables that are completely unnecessary. They’re fine and all. Just not necessary.

Morale break is not a rational behavior. It is brought on by fear of death by violent combat.

 

[cmad1977]

Morale break is not a rational behavior. It is brought on by fear of death by violent combat.

It’s also not random. It is determined by the goals of the NPC and what they are willing to do to achieve them?

Hungry spider? Runs away when hurt to find easier food.

Momma spider? Fights to the death to protect her egg sac.

 

[Dausuul]

The problem with morale is that it's devilishly difficult to craft a mechanic that a) delivers plausible results and b) does not require a ton of bookkeeping. The only way I've seen to solve this issue is to put more and more power into the DM's hands to judge when a morale check is appropriate... and at that point, it's only a short step to "The DM just decides when monsters run away," which is where we ended up.

As others have pointed out, there is also a "kill 'em all" mentality among players. I don't think it's about XP. My group hasn't used XP awards since 3E, and I still see it all the time, on both sides of the screen (heck, I do it myself). As soon as the enemy starts to flee, some kind of primal hunter reflex kicks in and everyone goes all-out to make sure that not a single damn one of the bastards gets away.

So the morale check is extra work with limited effect on the final outcome.

 

[Ralif Redhammer]

I do as well. And yet, certain players, even when informed of the fact, will go through great lengths to make sure their enemies are dead. Sometimes, the glee they take in running down fleeing foes, well, it’s a little disturbing.

I unusually award the same xp if monsters flee as if they are killed.

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

In my use of the 2d6 morale checks I would give the creature a bonus to their score if they are in their lair, or sometimes forgo the check altogether if they have no way to escape. Orcs with a leader and in their lair would have a morale of 10 (6 base +2 for leader +2 for lair). I would skip the morale check on initial encounter and only roll when they lose half their number or their leader is slain, or if the party is throwing around crazy magics that cowers them. Orcs tend to submit to powerful magic users. Defending their young would probably forgo a check altogether though orcs can be callous about the young and weak. Its in their craven nature.

Of course mindless creature have a morale of 12 and never roll, they just do what they do.

I also use the encounter reaction table from BECMI as well, within reason. Sometimes you run into that monster and it just isn't interesting in attacking you. Does the party then press the issue?

I like the system. It does work better in a system where HP are a more precious commodity than 5e and running down a group and walking into a larger group could lay the party up for a week.

 

[jasper]

Hmmm DC 10.
additions to roll
+1 per 4 hit dice
+1 if group is over 10. Addition +1 per 10
+1 if you have a leader type
+1 if you have wizard spells on your side
+1 if you have healing spells on your side.
Additions to DC
+ 5 if half group is destroyed.
+2 if out numbered by 3 or more pcs
etc