D&D General What it means for a race to end up in the PHB, its has huge significance

[Frozen_Heart]

Which is limiting in a way the new system is not. Want to play a half gnome half Goliath? The new rules cover that.

You could always just claim 'i'm playing a gnome goliath' (but they're actually just a gnome with 0 goliath traits) if the DM was cool with it.

The new method simply removes the rules for the two hybrid species which did exist. It's more limiting than before, and not less. Mechanically, the new system simply deletes hybrids from the game completely.

Pathfinder 2e has a far better method of handling half-elves and orcs, which can be applied to any species.

 

[LuisCarlos17f]

Or maybe the half-blood can be ordinarys with the "heritage" feat "half blood". Maybe she isn't the daughter but the grandaughter of a mixed marriage.

My suggestion is to add more racial traits.

 

[Frozen_Heart]

Ideally I'd like all species features to be separated into 'Trait A' and 'Trait B' (not sure if A and B would be equal power, or a major and minor trait).

There would then be a variant rule option, where if you want to make a hybrid, you would pick Trait A from one species, and Trait B from the other.

It would only need one additional page at most to explain the rules for it (probably less), while allowing full flexibility for people who care about both lore and mechanics.

 

[Belen]

I guess I expect more from the baseline rules. If I'm rewriting the mechanics because it suits my interests better, that's very different from the game-makers telling me "what's the problem, just keep seeing them as half-elves, it doesn't matter that they work exactly the same as [human/elf]." The former is my active choice to leave behind a distinction that matters in search of something better. The latter is the creators forcing me to give up something I usually like, because it's...inconvenient for them, I guess? It doesn't sit well with me.

Now, maybe if things had always been that way, so there would never be a feeling of loss, I wouldn't mind it. But the history of a thing matters, even if maybe I could have accepted the proposed change if it were a fresh choice without that history.

Frankly, if 5.5e doesn't include half-elves...I'll probably just ask DMs if they'll let me use the 5e half-elf rules with whatever tweaks are required to keep things on par (which, per the "backwards compatible" claim, shouldn't be difficult or result in excessive power.)

Edit: Further, the way 5e has implemented the whole "dragonmarked house" thing is subraces within a given race. They'll have to actually rewrite that if "half-elf" actually means "you use human rules" or "you use elf rules," because now that means dragonmarks have to be race-agnostic subraces--they need to work with both the baseline human traits and the baseline elven traits. Or there need to be different versions, one for each. Or they have to rework the entire Dragonmark rules to replace them with something else that won't intersect with race at all anymore.

I feel the same and I will continue to use the 5e half-elf in my games.

I really dislike the new rules because it turns them into a simple skin while seemingly also saying that any combination is valid. I think that will just make the DM's life a bit more difficult. I am sorry, but I do not see how there is a half-gnome, half-goliath in the setting unless there was some arcane or divine mojo in the mix.

It is the same way I feel that the Tasha's revisions are only meant for the optimizers.

 

[Horwath]

Or maybe the half-blood can be ordinarys with the "heritage" feat "half blood". Maybe she isn't the daughter but the grandaughter of a mixed marriage.

My suggestion is to add more racial traits.

yes.

or "X" blooded feat for 1st level.
you gain features from the race that fall into budget of 1st level feat.

you could be Orc with some Elven features or Elf with some Orc features.

 

[Mind of tempest]

It gives them prominence and legitimacy, but it doesn't guarantee that they stick in folks' minds. Gith, for example, have Dak'kon and now Lae'zel as poster characters, so if they were included in the 5.5e PHB, that might be a combo that resulted in substantially increased attention. The question is whether that attention has staying power. Dragons will always be cool because they represent power and majesty, regardless of what culture you look at; it is inherently a subversion to make a weak or cutesy dragon. Gith may not be able to sustain a PHB-driven boost, but certainly they'd get a boost, and probably never completely recede back to their old numbers, if they were added to the PHB.

gith suffer from being extra planer in nature they do not live in normal settings and thus are harder to use for homebrew.

heh, I get that.

But I really hate that ALL dragonborn, aasimars, tieflings, shifters and what not are same no matter what parent race is.

why should not elven tiefling be different from human one or dwarven?

that is one thing that I liked from 3.5e racial templates, pick base race, slap on template on it. Suffer the LA.
Since we do not have LA cost in 5E, and I do not want it, 1st level feat is a good cost for a template with possible 4th level half-feat for additional benefits.

dragonborn are not half-dragons they are closer to giant kobolds than anything else, a different member of the family tree.
the planer-hybrids I get as orc tiefling could be cool.

Yeah no clue how they handle this with Eberron.

A: They retcon khoravar and jhorgun'taal into full elves/orcs.
B: They create separate species for khoravar and jhorgun'taal, and treat them as completely their own thing.
or
C: They declare Eberron is problematic, and state that they won't be covering it again. Artificer is also never updated for 5.5e, and is eventually moved to legacy content and not allowed in official play.

they would likely have a chat with it creator so they can figure out what would work best.

 

[Hussar]

I feel the same and I will continue to use the 5e half-elf in my games.

I really dislike the new rules because it turns them into a simple skin while seemingly also saying that any combination is valid. I think that will just make the DM's life a bit more difficult. I am sorry, but I do not see how there is a half-gnome, half-goliath in the setting unless there was some arcane or divine mojo in the mix.

It is the same way I feel that the Tasha's revisions are only meant for the optimizers.

If a player comes to me and asks? Sure? I mean, okay. It matters so incredibly little. The only mechanical difference between an elf and a half elf is a couple of proficiencies. That's it. If having proficiency in longsword is your defining trait of elfdom, great? I guess?

Personally, I love the fact that not every race gets cookie cutter abilities. That half-elf you meet might have Halfling Luck as a trait. The next one might have fire resistance and can Hellish Rebuke. Fantastic. Variety is the spice of life. Half-elf as "elf lite" is boring, IMO. Viva la difference.

 

[Frozen_Heart]

If a player comes to me and asks? Sure? I mean, okay. It matters so incredibly little. The only mechanical difference between an elf and a half elf is a couple of proficiencies. That's it. If having proficiency in longsword is your defining trait of elfdom, great? I guess?

Personally, I love the fact that not every race gets cookie cutter abilities. That half-elf you meet might have Halfling Luck as a trait. The next one might have fire resistance and can Hellish Rebuke. Fantastic. Variety is the spice of life. Half-elf as "elf lite" is boring, IMO. Viva la difference.

Doesn't help that 50% of the 5e constituent parts is practically nothing, as the 5e human is practically nothing.

You need all the ingredients to make a cake, not just half of them.

Luckily it seems that 5.5e is fixing this, and making humans actually exist mechanically as a playable species.

 

[CreamCloud0]

If a player comes to me and asks? Sure? I mean, okay. It matters so incredibly little. The only mechanical difference between an elf and a half elf is a couple of proficiencies. That's it. If having proficiency in longsword is your defining trait of elfdom, great? I guess?

Personally, I love the fact that not every race gets cookie cutter abilities. That half-elf you meet might have Halfling Luck as a trait. The next one might have fire resistance and can Hellish Rebuke. Fantastic. Variety is the spice of life. Half-elf as "elf lite" is boring, IMO. Viva la difference.

i love when they don't get cookie cutter abilities...but i don't think that those abilities should be freely interchangable either, a half-elf shouldn't be getting halfling luck or tiefling fire affinity because they're not halflings or tieflings, nor should they really just be elf-lite but that's more an issue of mechanical representation not giving them their own distinct species traits between elf and human.

 

[EzekielRaiden]

If a player comes to me and asks? Sure? I mean, okay. It matters so incredibly little. The only mechanical difference between an elf and a half elf is a couple of proficiencies. That's it. If having proficiency in longsword is your defining trait of elfdom, great? I guess?

Personally, I love the fact that not every race gets cookie cutter abilities. That half-elf you meet might have Halfling Luck as a trait. The next one might have fire resistance and can Hellish Rebuke. Fantastic. Variety is the spice of life. Half-elf as "elf lite" is boring, IMO. Viva la difference.

Well, also some magic. Half-elves are mundane: some skills, some stats, a bit of resistance to being charmed or put to sleep. Elves are not mundane, especially in the playtest rules, where even Wood Elves get cantrips and spells. Admittedly, the new spells that Wood Elves get are some of the least overtly magical options, but even druidcraft is still pretty openly magical.

I also don't really buy that this isn't "cookie-cutter." It still is. It's just some of the cookies that look like chocolate chip are actually oatmeal raisin, which I like but I know many, many people find to be a rank betrayal on the order of Brutus or Cain. Custom lineage breaks the cookie-cutter way, way more than this change ever will.