D&D General When the fiction doesn't match the mechanics

[Hussar]

Let’s be honest here. Nothing in DnD makes narrative sense if you start picking at it. Character stats make no sense. Nothing does.

For a given value of “makes sense”.

However @Umbran has the right of it. Mechanics are an abstraction. They have always been an abstraction. You use that abstraction to create the narrative.

At no point in DnD’s history do the mechanics define the narrative. It’s always back filling after the resolution and whatever narrative the group is happy with is the “correct” narrative.

 

[cbwjm]

I've always felt that the armour class mechanic didn't fit the fiction, or at least what we wanted out of the fiction. I grew up reading about lightly armoured warriors or bare-chested barbarians, specifically Conan. He was this great warrior that would use armour but just as often had very little and was still this badass warrior tearing through his enemies. It's better now with unarmoured defence allowing you to build on the unarmoured warrior trope, but back in the day it was counter to the fiction.

 

[Lanefan]

Leveling doesn't always mesh the two well. For example, an apprentice wizard can spend weeks studying books and never learn any new spells. But if they shoot enough goblins with a crossbow they'll learn a few.

Having to train to level up covers this issue to some extent; also the way I see it that apprentice CAN learn new spells if long enough is spent at it.

Also, there's really not a good reason in most fiction for things like hitpoints, saves, and class skills to all improve at the same time.

As an abstraction of generally-improving abilities it's sorta-kinda good enough, to the point where it'll have to do. I agree it's not great.

In versions that allow item creation, spending XP to craft is always a problem. The wizard was about to learn a new spell, but now they can't because they made a scroll?

Yeah, that system never made any sense to me. Not one of 3e's shining moments.

 

[Hussar]

Having to train to level up covers this issue to some extent; also the way I see it that apprentice CAN learn new spells if long enough is spent at it.

.

Not really though. To qualify for training, I still have to shoot a bunch of goblins. Training rules had nothing to do with narratives and everything to do with sparkling over the xp for gold rules.

 

[Minigiant]

I've always felt that the armour class mechanic didn't fit the fiction, or at least what we wanted out of the fiction. I grew up reading about lightly armoured warriors or bare-chested barbarians, specifically Conan. He was this great warrior that would use armour but just as often had very little and was still this badass warrior tearing through his enemies. It's better now with unarmoured defence allowing you to build on the unarmoured warrior trope, but back in the day it was counter to the fiction.

The D&D AC mechanic was designed around better armor being the only way to increase defenses without leveling.

Light armor duelists were not initially intended to work. Same with armor naked barbarian and monks.

Rather not shifting these defenses to another type of defense and keep them as low AC warriors, D&D made it AC and struggled with it for decades.

 

[Yora]

Spell slots instantly come to mind.
They are probably the main reason why I never could really love any edition of D&D, and never was able to see it as a fitting system to represent living worlds.

 

[HaroldTheHobbit]

Well, the talk says that D&D is epic adventures in fantastic worlds, while the walk is that the game system still is made for killing perma-evil orcs in non-sensemaking dungeons.

 

[DarkCrisis]

Spell slots instantly come to mind.
They are probably the main reason why I never could really love any edition of D&D, and never was able to see it as a fitting system to represent living worlds.

There is a in-universe reason in like Forgotten Realms and Dragonlance and maybe others. Which basically boils down to “the gods do this to limit the power of magic”.

Same with why tech never really advances either. Gods just don’t allow it to. Certain metals don’t conduct elec as well like they do on Earth and black power isn’t as effect etc etc.


At the end of the day it’s all a game and a game has rules. And that’s why a lot of people say “D&D does D&D well”. IE better systems exist but D&D does what it does and it works well.

Oh and .Dragonlance more or less tries/tried to stick with the rules of the game. Read the original 1st novel, you can almost hear the dice rolling.

 

[Aldarc]

There is a in-universe reason in like Forgotten Realms and Dragonlance and maybe others. Which basically boils down to “the gods do this to limit the power of magic”.

These are post-hoc explanations in the fiction used to rationalize the mechanics.

 

[James Gasik]

The same size it was when you bought it at the coast before coming out here.

I'm sure you know what I meant; if you have to purchase a pearl while far away from their source, they become more valuable. Thus, a "100 gp pearl" bought far from the coast should be smaller than one purchased where they are plentiful.

So are spell component GP costs relative?