When you become invisible you can make a stealth check to hide.

[shmoo2]

Do you get a bonus to Stealth (or a penalty to the opponents Perception) when invisible?

Or am I thinking of the -10 to Perception when Blind?

 

[JoeNotCharles]

Do you get a bonus to Stealth (or a penalty to the opponents Perception) when invisible?

I believe the rules say no. I give a +5 to stealth anyway because it just seems to make sense.

 

[Ryujin]

I believe the rules say no. I give a +5 to stealth anyway because it just seems to make sense.

Not really. Whether you can't be seen because you're behind a wall or you can't be seen because you're invisible, you still can't be seen. I would tend to think that it's easier to hide behind a wall, because it helps to obscure any sound that you'd make.

If you're invisible then the observer could still make out dust that you kick up or footprints that you leave, so it gives no greater inherent advantage over total concealment.

 

[Kzach]

If you fail your Stealth check, you knock over a lamp.

Yes, but what really bends my noggen is whether or not you would have knocked over the lamp if you didn't make a Stealth check...

 

[ForbidenMaster]

Yes, but what really bends my noggen is whether or not you would have knocked over the lamp if you didn't make a Stealth check...

Yes, you would have knocked over the lamp if you did not make a stealth check. The stealth check is to try and avoid knocking over the lamp. You can replace knocking over a lamp with leaving a foot print, leaving a distinctive smell, making a distinctive sound, etc. You will do those things by default, your stealth check is an attempt to avoid doing such things to the extent that they are noticeable to your enemies.

 

[Felon]

Not really. Whether you can't be seen because you're behind a wall or you can't be seen because you're invisible, you still can't be seen. I would tend to think that it's easier to hide behind a wall, because it helps to obscure any sound that you'd make.

Perhaps, but most folks would tend to think it's harder to notice someone who's invisible (by the bits of dust he kicks up or little noises he makes) than it is to notice someone who's crouching between two bushes (because look, there's foot) or just standing in the shade (hey, there's a face!). To put it another way, the level of concealment should impact the detectability, not just the chance to hit them with an attack.

I guess one issue there is that 4e doesn't distinguish between noticing a creature's presence and pinpointing its location.

Another is that they may not have wanted to stack stealth bonuses from invisibility with the perception penalty from being blinded.

 

[Holy Bovine]

Yes, you would have knocked over the lamp if you did not make a stealth check. The stealth check is to try and avoid knocking over the lamp. You can replace knocking over a lamp with leaving a foot print, leaving a distinctive smell, making a distinctive sound, etc. You will do those things by default, your stealth check is an attempt to avoid doing such things to the extent that they are noticeable to your enemies.

I can do these both at the same time!

 

[ForbidenMaster]

Not really. Whether you can't be seen because you're behind a wall or you can't be seen because you're invisible, you still can't be seen. I would tend to think that it's easier to hide behind a wall, because it helps to obscure any sound that you'd make.

If you're invisible then the observer could still make out dust that you kick up or footprints that you leave, so it gives no greater inherent advantage over total concealment.

For what it is worth, I think it is. Passive perception is still a check and is still affected by modifiers. When listening through a wall the DC is increased by 10 (PHB page 187) and I see know reason why it shouldnt apply to a stealth check vs passive perception as well.

 

[Ajar]

Perhaps, but most folks would tend to think it's harder to notice someone who's invisible (by the bits of dust he kicks up or little noises he makes) than it is to notice someone who's crouching between two bushes (because look, there's foot) or just standing in the shade (hey, there's a face!). To put it another way, the level of concealment should impact the detectability, not just the chance to hit them with an attack.

I guess one issue there is that 4e doesn't distinguish between noticing a creature's presence and pinpointing its location.

Another is that they may not have wanted to stack stealth bonuses from invisibility with the perception penalty from being blinded.

I'm not sure I'd call knowing that the target is somewhere within a 5x5' square "pinpointing," but that's why the attack penalty vs invisible targets is there.

 

[Cadfan]

You are standing on square X. You go invisible. I saw you do so. I know that you are in square X, and can even see what visible evidence there is of your presence- footprints, etc, things I'd expect to see given that I just saw you go invisible.

But if you make a stealth check, maybe I lose sight of these things, and don't know where you are.